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2013 MLB Trade Deadline

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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby daingean » Fri Jul 19, 2013 5:36 pm

GoTribe028 wrote:
Reynolds is terrible at 3rd, Aviles true value is to be able to play all over, not be locked down to one position and how do you figure Santana can handle 3rd base at the major league level? Cause he has a heartbeat?


Santana was a 3B before the Dodgers converted him to C. Also both positions are quickness as opposed to range positions and arm strength is important.

Edit: I'd say that Santana could handle 3B but may need a month to get to an acceptable level defensively (same with a move to the OF).
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:03 pm

G'Son,

The Rangers can't take on any more pool space once they have capped out, they can continue to sign players, but cannot add pool space. As for the Cubs they could bc they have circumvented the rules by holding out on finalizing the Eloy Jimenez deal until after the July 31st trade deadline (my speculation). Regardless, the Cubs have not made his deal final yet. Plus they've reportedly been working on Jen-Ho Tseng. IMO, a large pool allotment ($1.9M) would be a meaningful starting point for Jeff Samardzija or maybe Travis Wood. Wood would fall into the controllable arm category... word is he wants a contract extension and the Cubs have no real reason to go through with it right now, bc they have 3 more yrs of control.

Small side note: FWIW, there have been rumors of the Cubs coveting Lonnie C. for a few yrs now.

Btw, Jesse Sanchez has reported the Tribe is in on 19yo Cuban defector Leandro Linares. There's very little info out there on him including signing demands, but it could affect the potential availability of the Tribes IFA pool slots. As of right now they can freely trade any of their four slots.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:13 pm

It seems logical for the Tribe to target James Russell - LHRP of the Cubs. He's a guy they say is not on the table, but I would think just about anyone on the Cubs is.

There has been some speculation that the Tribe might consider trading the competitive balance pk for a RP. I'm not sure I would, maybe IF the team kicked in someone else OR... it was someone the Tribe had long-term control over. Maybe I am over valuing the pick but would the comp pk for Russell and Valbuena be enough to pull the trigger?
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GoTribe028 » Fri Jul 19, 2013 8:05 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:It seems logical for the Tribe to target James Russell - LHRP of the Cubs. He's a guy they say is not on the table, but I would think just about anyone on the Cubs is.

There has been some speculation that the Tribe might consider trading the competitive balance pk for a RP. I'm not sure I would, maybe IF the team kicked in someone else OR... it was someone the Tribe had long-term control over. Maybe I am over valuing the pick but would the comp pk for Russell and Valbuena be enough to pull the trigger?


Luis Valbuena? Luis The V? Really?
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Fri Jul 19, 2013 9:07 pm

Yes sir...
Ole Louie V.

Just figured...
1) probably wouldn't get much more than Russell,
2) he could be a bench piece,
3) some "insurance" (not much) if they move ACab,
4) he is more or less a throw-in,
5) James Russell would be the key piece in that scenario.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 12:39 am

homerawayfromhome wrote:It depends who and what the Tribe puts on the table. Remember the Indians can deal up to half of their International FA pool slots and that competitive balance lottery pick which will land around mid-30's with a bonus pool slot over $1.5 M.

I'm not a fan of acq. Gallardo so I will pass using him as an example. So here's one I think might be reasonable & realistic...

ASTROS....
Jose Ramirez
Tyler Naquin
Preston Guilmet
Comp. balance draft pick.

INDIANS....
Bud Norris
Wesley Wright


Without the comp pick I'd maybe consider this. Norris is a solid #3 and under team control. Gives you some stability in that rotation. Had a solid year while switching leagues. Not exactly a Doug Fister type but I like him. Wright wouldn't be a bad add either. Both are under team control for a few more years.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 12:43 am

daingean wrote:
GoTribe028 wrote:
Reynolds is terrible at 3rd, Aviles true value is to be able to play all over, not be locked down to one position and how do you figure Santana can handle 3rd base at the major league level? Cause he has a heartbeat?


Santana was a 3B before the Dodgers converted him to C. Also both positions are quickness as opposed to range positions and arm strength is important.

Edit: I'd say that Santana could handle 3B but may need a month to get to an acceptable level defensively (same with a move to the OF).


Santana played more OF for the Dodgers than 3B though. I think he could possibly handle the spot but think it'd take an offseason to learn it...don't think he could make an in-season transition. Think he'd need the same for the OF (where I think he fits better).

Also, may want to try Gomes at 3B before Santana IF you moved Chiz in season. Gomes at least played 3B in the bigs last year so would be easier for him to go back IMO than Santana. I'd rather see Gomes behind the dish as he's better there than Santana, but think it could be disastrous for a while with Santana at 3B.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 12:48 am

GoTribe028 wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:It seems logical for the Tribe to target James Russell - LHRP of the Cubs. He's a guy they say is not on the table, but I would think just about anyone on the Cubs is.

There has been some speculation that the Tribe might consider trading the competitive balance pk for a RP. I'm not sure I would, maybe IF the team kicked in someone else OR... it was someone the Tribe had long-term control over. Maybe I am over valuing the pick but would the comp pk for Russell and Valbuena be enough to pull the trigger?


Luis Valbuena? Luis The V? Really?


Luis Valbuena has the 12th highest fWAR among all MLB 3Bs this year at 2.0. Higher than guys like Ryan Zimmerman, David Freese, Pablo Sandavol. brWAR doesn't like him quite as much but still 15th at 1.3. He's having a solid year, playing a solid 3B defensively. No spot for him right now but if you moved a Chiz or Asdrubal he could be a nice bench guy.

Offensively been solid too...has the 11th best OPS among MLB 3Bs at .739...which is higher than Chase Headley, David Freese, Pablo Sandoval, Todd Frazier, Martin Padro....and our own Mark Reynolds (.691 currently)...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:57 am

Hermie13 wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:It depends who and what the Tribe puts on the table. Remember the Indians can deal up to half of their International FA pool slots and that competitive balance lottery pick which will land around mid-30's with a bonus pool slot over $1.5 M.

I'm not a fan of acq. Gallardo so I will pass using him as an example. So here's one I think might be reasonable & realistic...

ASTROS....
Jose Ramirez
Tyler Naquin
Preston Guilmet
Comp. balance draft pick.

INDIANS....
Bud Norris
Wesley Wright


Without the comp pick I'd maybe consider this. Norris is a solid #3 and under team control. Gives you some stability in that rotation. Had a solid year while switching leagues. Not exactly a Doug Fister type but I like him. Wright wouldn't be a bad add either. Both are under team control for a few more years.

Yeah, I was tempted to add Chris Carter, Lucas Harrell or Jose Veras to this scenario but it's hard to know how they value Wright and the comp pick. Wright has had some issues this yr, but has been a good LH over his brief career. As for the comp pick it is a tremendous chip, but I'm not sure how to value it in a trade, maybe a B level prospect bc of the $$$ figure it represents.

EDIT: I thought Norris had 3+ yrs of control --- thought he was a Super2 player. He is not and has 2+ yrs of control remaining. That would affect the offer...
Last edited by homerawayfromhome on Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:19 am

Hermie13 wrote:
GoTribe028 wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:It seems logical for the Tribe to target James Russell - LHRP of the Cubs. He's a guy they say is not on the table, but I would think just about anyone on the Cubs is.

There has been some speculation that the Tribe might consider trading the competitive balance pk for a RP. I'm not sure I would, maybe IF the team kicked in someone else OR... it was someone the Tribe had long-term control over. Maybe I am over valuing the pick but would the comp pk for Russell and Valbuena be enough to pull the trigger?


Luis Valbuena? Luis The V? Really?


Luis Valbuena has the 12th highest fWAR among all MLB 3Bs this year at 2.0. Higher than guys like Ryan Zimmerman, David Freese, Pablo Sandavol. brWAR doesn't like him quite as much but still 15th at 1.3. He's having a solid year, playing a solid 3B defensively. No spot for him right now but if you moved a Chiz or Asdrubal he could be a nice bench guy.

Offensively been solid too...has the 11th best OPS among MLB 3Bs at .739...which is higher than Chase Headley, David Freese, Pablo Sandoval, Todd Frazier, Martin Padro....and our own Mark Reynolds (.691 currently)...

I was actually thinking beyond this season too. Valbuena is controllable for 3 more yrs, and could be a nice UTL bench piece. IF ACab is traded at the deadline or this offseason Valbuena would provide an instant backup for Mike Aviles. Btw, I'm s implying saying Valbuena would be a throw-in in such a scenario.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Bearcatbob » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:04 pm

We need a left handed reliever! We also need brains!

Edit: Unbelievable pain.

Edit: And Kluber was pulled why?

Edit: Et tu Jason?

We stink. IMO we thought these were jock strap wins. Throw it out on the field and cash the win. Utter pain.

Edit: And you too Droobs!
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:13 pm

Bearcatbob wrote:We need a left handed reliever! We also need brains!

Edit: Unbelievable pain.

Edit: And Kluber was pulled why?

Edit: Et tu Jason?

We stink. IMO we thought these were jock strap wins. Throw it out on the field and cash the win. Utter pain.

Edit: And you too Droobs!


Due to injury...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:06 pm

Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby A.Zajac » Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:52 pm

Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...


I think the Cubs did pretty well. I'm also glad the Indians decided not to engage in that bidding war.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:53 pm

Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...

Definitely a good return for Garza.

Anyone picking up anything on the RRod rumors?

To clarify, he posted on Twitter thanks for everything and removed his pic. of himself in a Tribe uniform. Then made it say something like for playing in the US.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:55 pm

A.Zajac wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...


I think the Cubs did pretty well. I'm also glad the Indians decided not to engage in that bidding war.


Agree, would have loved Garza but not at that price.

Garza's value on the open market just went up too (most likely). No draft pick will be tied to him now...a guy I'd like to go after but could be cost prohibitive. Think he could top $65M...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby A.Zajac » Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:59 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...

Definitely a good return for Garza.

Anyone picking up anything on the RRod rumors?

To clarify, he posted on Twitter thanks for everything and removed his pic. of himself in a Tribe uniform. Then made it say something like for playing in the US.


Heard word just recently his tweet was misinterpreted and he's in the starting lineup tonight. Something still doesn't quite add up to me.. but for now, nothing to note.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:02 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...

Definitely a good return for Garza.

Anyone picking up anything on the RRod rumors?

To clarify, he posted on Twitter thanks for everything and removed his pic. of himself in a Tribe uniform. Then made it say something like for playing in the US.


Saw the tweets and was wondering what that was all about...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:34 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...

Definitely a good return for Garza.

Anyone picking up anything on the RRod rumors?

To clarify, he posted on Twitter thanks for everything and removed his pic. of himself in a Tribe uniform. Then made it say something like for playing in the US.


Saw the tweets and was wondering what that was all about...


Nothing.. leading into the All Star Break..there were a number of stories indicating which teams were on which side of the fence as it relates to who would buy.. who would sell and what their particular currency was. For example..The Flubs are a sell team.. they have a Garza to sell.. The Indians are a buy team and they have strength in their minor league system up the middle including Francisco Lindor, Ronnie Rodriguez, Jose Ramirez, and Tony Wolters (so the author got it wrong) along with other possible targets. Other than offering general comments, no deals were indicated as being imminent.. on any front. for these Indians' players.

The only thing I might add, by listing the names.. there could be "consideration" or attention that otherwise would not have been forthcoming.. That is.. even though Matt Garza has been traded, consideration / attention to Ronnie Rod may have piqued someone's interest.. That could be where a deal could manifest..but..

As of this writing. nothing substantial has emerged..
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:39 pm

A.Zajac wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:Garza traded to the Rangers. Looks like Olt, Edwards, and Grimm plus a ptbnl going to the Cubs.

Very good haul for a rental...

Definitely a good return for Garza.

Anyone picking up anything on the RRod rumors?

To clarify, he posted on Twitter thanks for everything and removed his pic. of himself in a Tribe uniform. Then made it say something like for playing in the US.


Heard word just recently his tweet was misinterpreted and he's in the starting lineup tonight. Something still doesn't quite add up to me.. but for now, nothing to note.

Sounds like something might be close... Could be nothing, then again this time of yr makes you wonder.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 12:33 am

Neil Ramirez could be the PTBNL in the Garza deal according to sources...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:15 am

Hermie13 wrote:Neil Ramirez could be the PTBNL in the Garza deal according to sources...


Of all the minor league systems, the Rangers seem to be flush with 6'2" to 6'7" 200 plus pound monsters that all throw low to mid 90's fastballs and better. The Rangers must have nearly 40 pitchers in AAA, AA, A+ and A ball like that. It's like they have a cloning machine that keeps pumping them out... Well, it's not for lack of arms being available.. it's which one is going to develop the control and confidence to put all their pitches, including that third pitch in quality locations for strikes..

The Cubs may be best served to look at that two-fer (instead of Neil Ramirez) with the depth of upside arms the Rangers have... we shall see..
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby ASUTribefan » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:48 am

Yankees close to getting Soriano from Cubs.
i just dont see the Indians making a move until winter meetings
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Jul 23, 2013 12:53 pm

ASUTribefan wrote:Yankees close to getting Soriano from Cubs.
i just dont see the Indians making a move until winter meetings

I disagree, IF they are going to make a run at the division they should consider a few moves. Personally, I think they should be both sellers and buyers. That said, they should not move an ACab for example unless they are getting a now player (example: Lance Lynn) in return. As for minor parts...guys like Mark Reynolds, Joe Smith should be expendable IF the right circumstances are presented.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:02 pm

ASUTribefan wrote:Yankees close to getting Soriano from Cubs.
i just dont see the Indians making a move until winter meetings


So what if they don't? Is there a move out there right now that's 1) realistic and 2) going to make this team good enough to actually be better than the Tigers?

There aren't any starters outside of Garza who are/were available that would really be worth adding to the mix. Peavy and Norris really get you that excited? Maybe if the price was right, which it never is. Cliff Lee isn't likely being traded and even if he were shopped to us, the best trade chip the Indians have in Lindor isn't going anywhere.

There aren't any bats out there either. Just more supplemental types the Indians have plenty of. No real impact bats are out there. A platoon partner for Stubbs, maybe another infielder who can come off the bench if the Indians decide to move on from Giambi.

I can see a few moves come in the pen. I could actually see Joe Smith/Matt Albers get moved, Hill DFA'd, maybe Pestano DL'd, Shaw potentially demoted. There's a lot of parts need fixed in the pen. It also doesn't help that only Masterson and occasionally Kluber can get into the 7th inning and the pen gets more work than I'm comfortable with.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby ASUTribefan » Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:06 pm

what do you mean so what if they dont? it means another year without the playoffs, thats what. its NEVER going to be acceptable to miss the playoff when you're only 2.5 out a week before the deadline and can make a move to have a better chance to win and make the post-season. this is why we have to overspend to get FAs, nobody wants to play for a losing team.

The Tigers aren't anything great this year, no reason not to make a move and try to catch them.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby A.Zajac » Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:13 pm

My philosophy for this year is simply this: Yeah, the Tigers are greatly underperforming, there's no question about that. BUT, there's no question they have so much more talent than we do.. both in their lineup and in their rotation. Their bullpen sucks, sure.. but they could add K-Rod. I'm not willing to overpay in a trade just to POSSIBLY make the playoffs this season. At the right price, I'm willing to add a few pieces, but not at a great expense to our future either. I've previously mentioned that Lindor and Salazar are my untouchables.. I would move Jose Ramirez, Ronny Rodriguez, Trevor Bauer, and/or Carlos Carrasco in the right deals.. Tyler Naquin I would personally like to keep. Our time has a lot of holes, there's no doubt about that, but I don't want to mortgage our future for a rental or a temporary stop-gap. I'm willing to see what we have from certain players and make a run for 2014 than risk our future. I believe we should make moves, yes, and I want this team to get better, don't get me wrong. Like I said, my biggest concern is overpaying.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:20 pm

ASUTribefan wrote:what do you mean so what if they dont? it means another year without the playoffs, thats what. its NEVER going to be acceptable to miss the playoff when you're only 2.5 out a week before the deadline and can make a move to have a better chance to win and make the post-season. this is why we have to overspend to get FAs, nobody wants to play for a losing team.

The Tigers aren't anything great this year, no reason not to make a move and try to catch them.


If you're asking / demanding that the Indians do something to make them better.. that's agreed. FULLY 100 % no doubt about it..The Indians have to be a better team.. If they can become better, then the Indians have a better chance to be playing in meaningful games in September, and, perhaps, October..

So.. how do the Indians get there?.. Where are your suggestions?..

What moves are realistically possible?..

Or is this posting similar to your others.. where you've proclaimed a problem exists, thereby identifying it with aplomb !!

If you don't have a realistic solution or possible solution to the "..the Indians need to get better because the Tigers aren't anything great", then what have you provided to the thread?.. Go get Cliff Lee?. for what price?????..If you feel the need to go to the edge of ridiculous.. Why just Cliff Lee, why not Clayton Kershaw?..David Price?.both?. others more than just others?

There's realistic and then there's problem identification without resolution. Which one have you provided?...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:23 pm

A.Zajac wrote:My philosophy for this year is simply this: Yeah, the Tigers are greatly underperforming, there's no question about that. BUT, there's no question they have so much more talent than we do.. both in their lineup and in their rotation. Their bullpen sucks, sure.. but they could add K-Rod. I'm not willing to overpay in a trade just to POSSIBLY make the playoffs this season. At the right price, I'm willing to add a few pieces, but not at a great expense to our future either. I've previously mentioned that Lindor and Salazar are my untouchables.. I would move Jose Ramirez, Ronny Rodriguez, Trevor Bauer, and/or Carlos Carrasco in the right deals.. Tyler Naquin I would personally like to keep. Our time has a lot of holes, there's no doubt about that, but I don't want to mortgage our future for a rental or a temporary stop-gap. I'm willing to see what we have from certain players and make a run for 2014 than risk our future. I believe we should make moves, yes, and I want this team to get better, don't get me wrong. Like I said, my biggest concern is overpaying.


You biggest concern should be failing.. You're gonna pay or over pay. regardless...

So, you've identified the currency to be spent to acquire the talent needed to win the division.. So.. who is going to be inside the package when we open it up?..
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Tondo » Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:43 pm

A.Zajac wrote:My philosophy for this year is simply this: Yeah, the Tigers are greatly underperforming, there's no question about that. BUT, there's no question they have so much more talent than we do.. both in their lineup and in their rotation. Their bullpen sucks, sure.. but they could add K-Rod. I'm not willing to overpay in a trade just to POSSIBLY make the playoffs this season. At the right price, I'm willing to add a few pieces, but not at a great expense to our future either. I've previously mentioned that Lindor and Salazar are my untouchables.. I would move Jose Ramirez, Ronny Rodriguez, Trevor Bauer, and/or Carlos Carrasco in the right deals.. Tyler Naquin I would personally like to keep. Our time has a lot of holes, there's no doubt about that, but I don't want to mortgage our future for a rental or a temporary stop-gap. I'm willing to see what we have from certain players and make a run for 2014 than risk our future. I believe we should make moves, yes, and I want this team to get better, don't get me wrong. Like I said, my biggest concern is overpaying.


I agree but would switch J.Ramirez with Naquin in your assessment. Ramirez is 17 months younger, playing in a more advanced league, showing a better approach at the plate, has better speed and plays a higher value position than Naquin.

Frankly, I'd try to "sell high" on Naquin, as I think he'll turn into another Fedroff/Holt mix. Don't get me wrong, I like all 3 and think they have at least fringe MLB talent and can be usefull if given a chance, but if a GM I'm trying to swing a deal with values them equally or Naquin even higher, then I'd try to make him bite and keep JRam.

Carrasco and Bauer are frustrating. We have to give Bauer another season, but Carrasco I fear is one of those that needs a change of scenery to become a Major Leaguer, but it won't be with the Indians. Not sure how much longer we can wait for him to get his "stuff" together?

Of all the MIF guys, RROd is the guy I'd look to trade as he's the most inconsistent. I'd rather trade him than Wendle at this point.

RRod+Naquin+Carrasco should be enough to land a decent MLB SP + LHRP, no? Norris+W.Wright? Too much? Not enough? but I think I would do this
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Edible14 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:11 pm

I think Naquin is likely going to end up being the Cord Phelps to Clint Frazier's Jason Kipnis. He's older and on a faster track, but it seems like if he ever gets to Cleveland he won't be there for long (at least not in a starting role). I definitely trade him given a good enough offer, but I don't see any great trade targets out there right now. I certainly don't trade him for a lefty reliever, which is really all we need to be targeting. If we're going after someone like James Russell, I don't want to give up more than Phelps/Wendle and a righty reliever (maybe Brian Price).

Also, don't look now, but Nick Hagadone has quietly sorted himself out somewhat, and has become at least a replacement level player. It's sad that this is noteworthy, but since he was outright atrocious earlier this year, it counts as a positive development.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby indians1 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:37 pm

To me it isn"t even a question which middle infielder should get moved. i Just wonder how much he is really valued among other teams and how much we could get for him in a deal. Obviously it would include other prospects/players. The guy is ronny rodriguez. Anybody with a BB/K ratio of 9/53 does not project well in the majors.

I think jose ramirez at least becomes a very good backup to Lindor and Kipnis and could play both 2B and SS.

If teams do value rodriguez high, i would hope the indians move him for a relief pitcher or a starter in a deal for other prospects/players.

If the indians had to give up Asdrubal and ronny rodriguez for a good starting pitcher, you do the deal in a heart beat. the question is would the teams with extra pitching like St. Louis want Rodriguez.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:12 pm

The O's have acq. Francisco Rodriguez - RHRP from the Brewers for Nick Delmonico - IF.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:25 pm

Just thinking out loud here...

The Tribe SHOULD make some aggressive moves in the next few days. IMHO, they cannot afford to sit idle. The way I see it, the Tribe has to look big picture. I honestly don't see them overtaking the Tigers at this point, this team is just lacking. But big picture the Tribe needs to make some moves to extend their window opportunity.

Here's where I'm going....ACab, Masterson and CPerez are all under team control for the 1+ yr. IMO, they need to extend these parts by way of adding yrs to them OR...by turning them into other pieces that will help extend this window. It should also be noted that Smith, Albers, Jimenez, Kazmir, and Reynolds will all be FA at seasons end. Also, Hill, and Myers are FA as well, plus Marson could be a DFA candidate. That's a lot of modest-to-fringe value the Tribe will be losing. But it is still value.

This is why I think the Tribe should be aggressive looking to change the landscape on this team. I know they are contending for the division but can they win it? I'm not sure, but they certainly have to consider this season and next, and beyond. All of that said, I think they should actively look to move any player they will not consider extending beyond this yr or next. That includes all of ACab, CPerez, Jimenez, Albers, and Reynolds. I would guess they would want to extend Kazmir, Masterson and maybe Smith?

There are several controllable commodities I think the Tribe should target in trades. Here's a few I think they should make an aggressive run at...Bud Norris, Wesley Wright, Joe Thatcher, James Russell, Charles Furbush, Mike Dunn, Nate Schierholtz and Ryan Webb. Obviously, they all won't be fits but several of these guys would improve the roster, IMHO.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:48 pm

The Indians started the day 2 1/2 games back of the Tigers after losing two of three to the twins (two games given away) and losing the opener in Seattle. All three losses were one run, low scoring contests where the big hit.. or the hit w/ RISP didn't get done...Switch those games around.. and the Indians have a 1/2 game lead.. but, revisionist history isn't what this posting is about..It's about what can be done.. and what should be done...

The listing of players who are available for trade by Homer & I1, & Ed & Tondo & Zajac. grouped together encompass just about everyone not named Lindor or Kipnis. EVERYONE else is on the table. There are no other untouchables. If the right deal comes along.. it's made.. All the postings that defined who would be available are incomplete. EVERYONE except Kipnis and Lindor are AVAILABLE. So. CP this.. and Droobs that and vinnie here.. and cody there..and contract length and so on and so on... THEY'RE ALL AVAILABLE. EVERYONE..NO ONE IS IMMUNE from being Dealt.. SO who comes back?.

James Russel?..really? is he who we're definging as an impact player.. I don't think so..

How about Bud Norris. Is he what the Indians need to really show em we (the Indians) mean business? I don't think so either. Bud Norris is a fine starting pitcher. He'll probably have that etched on his grave stone "I was a fine starting pitcher in Major League Baseball". Inspiring/impactfull.. he's not..

Are the Indians trying to incrementally improve.. or make a BIG Impactful improvement?. Joe Thatcher?. Betcha more than half the people that read this blog think Joe Thatcher makes roofs in Jolly Old England and isn't San Diego's most used match up left handed reliever?.. Extensions are for the post season.. Kazmir.. maybe masterson and smith and droobs and a bunch of other guys too.. that is, they should all be extended/retained if for no other reason that to keep some continuity. but this is the trading deadline. this isn't the time to do that stuff.. this is the time to either buy or sell. And other than some mildly interesting players. it doesn't look like anyone of interest is being discussed.. at all.. shrugs shoulders and goes back to watching the Indians/Mariners tilt>...
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby Edible14 » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:50 am

I'm game for a big, impact move. I don't see one out there to be made at this point. I might have argued for the likes of Garza or Nolasco, but they've been traded. Cliff Lee isn't available, and at his contract I wouldn't care if he was. Bud Norris isn't an impact move. Eric Stultz is an interesting option if you think he's available or that he'll translate outside of Petco (I assume the answer to both is "no").

The Indians are good enough at every position that they really don't have much use for an average player. They don't have a position on the team that isn't producing, outside of the DH spot (and that isn't too bad if Raburn/Gomes/Aviles are playing instead of Giambi/Reynolds). I guess they could try to trade for Michael Young, but that's far from an "impact" trade. The guys that are being shopped - Morneau, Young, Rios and Soriano - are all deeply flawed and not necessarily a better bet than Reynolds simply improving (or just playing Raburn more. Seriously... why isn't Raburn getting more time at DH?).

In the rotation, the problem is murkier. Masterson and Kluber are basically untouchable where they are. There are no pitchers out there that improve on what they're providing. Bud Norris might be an incremental improvement over Kazmir or McAllister, but that's hardly a game-changer. He'd be a big improvement over Ubaldo, but they'd have to cut bait on Ubaldo for that to happen. They need an ace, or at least a 2/3 guy, to improve the rotation. There are none out there.

Meanwhile, in the bullpen, the only 3 relievers to have a positive WAR are Cody Allen, Bryan Shaw and... Rich Hill (at .1, so it's not like he's setting the world on fire). But the big problems there are Chris Perez (whose surface stats are nice, but his high strand rate, low BABIP, and high walk rate suggest it won't last) and Vinnie Pestano. Pestano is hurt, and has enough recent success that you can't justify dumping him. Perez is someone nobody is willing to take in a trade at this point with his off-field antics and lack of on-field success. So that's where a trade is to be made if we're looking short term.

If we're looking long-term, though, I think trading ACab to the Cardinals for couple of pitching prospects is the way to go. Given the volatility of Carrasco and Bauer, and the always-present risk that starters will get hurt or implode, I think another starter would be great for the team long-term. Cabrera hasn't had that great of a year, and given his age I'm not sure that it's prudent to expect that to change. His average, OBP, slugging and production all point down (Seems to be a real issue too, "stable" stats like his o-swing% and z-contact% suggest that this year's increase in Ks is here to stay). He's always been a below-average defender at SS, but it is arguable, right now, that Mike Aviles is a better player. In fact, in 100 fewer ABs, Aviles has a WAR .2 higher. In fact, of the 13 guys to have more than 100 ABs for the Tribe this year, Asdrubal has the third WORST production if you go by WAR (Giambi and Reynolds are the only ones worse, naturally).
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Wed Jul 24, 2013 6:56 am

@ G'Son,

Point being they need to acq. good young controllable players, with long term in mind its that simple. I'm not suggesting deals to make deals but this club has to consider about any and every deal, IMHO. I've already thrown several suggestions out there... There are no big impact deals out there that change the landscape of the team. No huge superstars will be dealt, so players like Norris a #3 SP with control and a modest price is valuable. As for others... Relievers to fill holes in the pen now and for the next few yrs. As I said, they should be active buyers and sellers but for humors sake I will try to put out some trade suggestions later today.


In other news... The White Sox have reportedly brushed back the Cards offer of Carlos Martinez for Alexei Ramirez. This has been worn out in these threads but it's a team the Tribe probably is talking to. I think it's time to flip ACab for a cpl prospects like Wacha and Cooney or Jones. ACabs value is probably higher now than it will be in the offseason despite his "off" yr.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GeronimoSon » Wed Jul 24, 2013 8:52 am

homerawayfromhome wrote:@ G'Son,

Point being they need to acq. good young controllable players, with long term in mind its that simple. I'm not suggesting deals to make deals but this club has to consider about any and every deal, IMHO. I've already thrown several suggestions out there... There are no big impact deals out there that change the landscape of the team. No huge superstars will be dealt, so players like Norris a #3 SP with control and a modest price is valuable. As for others... Relievers to fill holes in the pen now and for the next few yrs. As I said, they should be active buyers and sellers but for humors sake I will try to put out some trade suggestions later today.


In other news... The White Sox have reportedly brushed back the Cards offer of Carlos Martinez for Alexei Ramirez. This has been worn out in these threads but it's a team the Tribe probably is talking to. I think it's time to flip ACab for a cpl prospects like Wacha and Cooney or Jones. ACabs value is probably higher now than it will be in the offseason despite his "off" yr.


Homer.. my point wasn't to denigrate your ideas or suggestions..It was more of "..clear the air and focus on what the real problem is and what needs to be done to FIX IT.." The current market says there are limited choices.What the Indians really need is someone that is under performing for a team going nowhere fast (example: Doug Fister with the Mariners before being acquired by the Tigers). The guys that could fit that mold include:

Short Term Rentals:
-Josh Johnson (Blue Jays, 2 month rental ~$ 4 MM)
-Tim Lincecum (Giants,2 month rental, ~$ 6 MM )

Expensive/Controllable Vet(s)
-Jake Peavy (CWSox, 1 year 2 months ~$ 18 MM)

Young/Controllable w/ Upside
-Wily Peralta (Brewers, Not yet arbitration eligible )
-Jeff Samardzija (Cubs, ARBI, $ 800K)
-Henderson Alvarez (Marlins, Not yet arbitration eligible)
-Andrew Cashner (Padres, $ 170 K ARBI)
-Jhoulys Chacin (Rockies, $ 515K, ARBII@4.8 MM, ARBIII )

There may be more than these 8 guys. With one week to go until the clock strikes twelve, a couple of these teams may not believe their season is, for all intents and purposes, over. The Jays and Giants fit into that genre.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby daingean » Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:13 am

GeronimoSon wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:@ G'Son,

Point being they need to acq. good young controllable players, with long term in mind its that simple. I'm not suggesting deals to make deals but this club has to consider about any and every deal, IMHO. I've already thrown several suggestions out there... There are no big impact deals out there that change the landscape of the team. No huge superstars will be dealt, so players like Norris a #3 SP with control and a modest price is valuable. As for others... Relievers to fill holes in the pen now and for the next few yrs. As I said, they should be active buyers and sellers but for humors sake I will try to put out some trade suggestions later today.


In other news... The White Sox have reportedly brushed back the Cards offer of Carlos Martinez for Alexei Ramirez. This has been worn out in these threads but it's a team the Tribe probably is talking to. I think it's time to flip ACab for a cpl prospects like Wacha and Cooney or Jones. ACabs value is probably higher now than it will be in the offseason despite his "off" yr.


Homer.. my point wasn't to denigrate your ideas or suggestions..It was more of "..clear the air and focus on what the real problem is and what needs to be done to FIX IT.." The current market says there are limited choices.What the Indians really need is someone that is under performing for a team going nowhere fast (example: Doug Fister with the Mariners before being acquired by the Tigers). The guys that could fit that mold include:

Short Term Rentals:
-Josh Johnson (Blue Jays, 2 month rental ~$ 4 MM)
-Tim Lincecum (Giants,2 month rental, ~$ 6 MM )

Expensive/Controllable Vet(s)
-Jake Peavy (CWSox, 1 year 2 months ~$ 18 MM)

Young/Controllable w/ Upside
-Wily Peralta (Brewers, Not yet arbitration eligible )
-Jeff Samardzija (Cubs, ARBI, $ 800K)
-Henderson Alvarez (Marlins, Not yet arbitration eligible)
-Andrew Cashner (Padres, $ 170 K ARBI)
-Jhoulys Chacin (Rockies, $ 515K, ARBII@4.8 MM, ARBIII )

There may be more than these 8 guys. With one week to go until the clock strikes twelve, a couple of these teams may not believe their season is, for all intents and purposes, over. The Jays and Giants fit into that genre.


I understand the need for another pitcher but I think there's a greater need of adding a bat especially a middle of the order type. I know those can be almost as costly as an arm.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby ASUTribefan » Wed Jul 24, 2013 1:44 pm

ho hum another day another loss, free falling like an anchor since the ASB, but we dont need to make a move right? Laughable.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:39 pm

Since I have openly stated I think the Tribe should be both buyers and sellers here's several trades I would like to see go down...

ACab and Joe Smith to STL for Michael Wacha - RHSP, Tim Cooney - LHSP and Cory Jones - RHSP

Reynolds and Albers to TX for Nick Williams - OF and Connor Sadzeck - RHSP


Jose Ramirez, Nick Hagadone and $1M IFA funds to CHIC for James Russell - LHRP, Nate Schierholtz - OF / 1b and Luis Valbuena - UTL

Tyler Naquin, Shawn Morimando and Preston Guilmet to HOU for Bud Norris - RHSP

Carlos Moncrief to MIA for Ryan Webb - RHRP

Ronny Rodriguez to SEA for Kendrys Morales - DH / 1b

ARRIVING...
(Prospects)
Michael Wacha - RHSP
Tim Cooney - LHSP
Cory Jones - RHSP
Nick Williams - OF
Connor Sadzeck - RHSP
(Big Leaguers)
Kendrys Morales
James Russell
Nate Schierholtz
Luis Valbuena
Bud Norris
Ryan Webb

GOING....
ACab
Joe Smith
Reynolds
Albers
Naquin
JRamirez
Hagadone
Guilmet
Morimando
Moncrief
RRodriguez
$1 M IFA funds
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby GoTribe028 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:06 am

ASUTribefan wrote:ho hum another day another loss, free falling like an anchor since the ASB, but we dont need to make a move right? Laughable.


Lmao a 2-4 stretch is "free falling like an achor"?! It's not a good week, but hardly a free fall. :lol :rolleyes

Go play xbox or baseball mogul if you want to see the Indians make a thousand fantasy deals. Pretty pointless constantly worrying about it.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:41 am

homerawayfromhome wrote:Since I have openly stated I think the Tribe should be both buyers and sellers here's several trades I would like to see go down...

ACab and Joe Smith to STL for Michael Wacha - RHSP, Tim Cooney - LHSP and Cory Jones - RHSP

Reynolds and Albers to TX for Nick Williams - OF and Connor Sadzeck - RHSP


Jose Ramirez, Nick Hagadone and $1M IFA funds to CHIC for James Russell - LHRP, Nate Schierholtz - OF / 1b and Luis Valbuena - UTL

Tyler Naquin, Shawn Morimando and Preston Guilmet to HOU for Bud Norris - RHSP

Carlos Moncrief to MIA for Ryan Webb - RHRP

Ronny Rodriguez to SEA for Kendrys Morales - DH / 1b

ARRIVING...
(Prospects)
Michael Wacha - RHSP
Tim Cooney - LHSP
Cory Jones - RHSP
Nick Williams - OF
Connor Sadzeck - RHSP
(Big Leaguers)
Kendrys Morales
James Russell
Nate Schierholtz
Luis Valbuena
Bud Norris
Ryan Webb

GOING....
ACab
Joe Smith
Reynolds
Albers
Naquin
JRamirez
Hagadone
Guilmet
Morimando
Moncrief
RRodriguez
$1 M IFA funds

How much of this is realistic? Probably, a few deals...what will the Tribe do between now and 7-31 (8-31)? Probably not much, but I think they will be active in trade talks and likely acq. a LHRP and maybe a bat like Morales / Young... but the price has to be right. These are my short and long term solutions.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby ASUTribefan » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:08 am

GoTribe028 wrote:
ASUTribefan wrote:ho hum another day another loss, free falling like an anchor since the ASB, but we dont need to make a move right? Laughable.


Lmao a 2-4 stretch is "free falling like an achor"?! It's not a good week, but hardly a free fall. :lol :rolleyes

Go play xbox or baseball mogul if you want to see the Indians make a thousand fantasy deals. Pretty pointless constantly worrying about it.


yeah falling 2 more games behind a playoff spot at this point in the season is a free fall. its unacceptable for them to have gone worse then 4-2 on this mini road trip considering the teams they were playing.
Last edited by ASUTribefan on Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby ASUTribefan » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:12 am

homerawayfromhome wrote:Since I have openly stated I think the Tribe should be both buyers and sellers here's several trades I would like to see go down...

ACab and Joe Smith to STL for Michael Wacha - RHSP, Tim Cooney - LHSP and Cory Jones - RHSP

Reynolds and Albers to TX for Nick Williams - OF and Connor Sadzeck - RHSP


Jose Ramirez, Nick Hagadone and $1M IFA funds to CHIC for James Russell - LHRP, Nate Schierholtz - OF / 1b and Luis Valbuena - UTL

Tyler Naquin, Shawn Morimando and Preston Guilmet to HOU for Bud Norris - RHSP

Carlos Moncrief to MIA for Ryan Webb - RHRP

Ronny Rodriguez to SEA for Kendrys Morales - DH / 1b

ARRIVING...
(Prospects)
Michael Wacha - RHSP
Tim Cooney - LHSP
Cory Jones - RHSP
Nick Williams - OF
Connor Sadzeck - RHSP
(Big Leaguers)
Kendrys Morales
James Russell
Nate Schierholtz
Luis Valbuena
Bud Norris
Ryan Webb

GOING....
ACab
Joe Smith
Reynolds
Albers
Naquin
JRamirez
Hagadone
Guilmet
Morimando
Moncrief
RRodriguez
$1 M IFA funds



those are alot of bad trades for the indians, the only decent one is the Tex deal
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby homerawayfromhome » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:12 pm

Unfortunately, that is reality of making trades this time of yr... You over pay to get what you want, it's hard to get value in return, IMHO when your the buyer. Then again same could be said of the seller.

Ultimately, I think the Tribe makes a couple minor deals...one for one type trades maybe for a vet bat and LHRP.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby A.Zajac » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:16 pm

ASUTribefan wrote:
GoTribe028 wrote:
ASUTribefan wrote:ho hum another day another loss, free falling like an anchor since the ASB, but we dont need to make a move right? Laughable.


Lmao a 2-4 stretch is "free falling like an achor"?! It's not a good week, but hardly a free fall. :lol :rolleyes

Go play xbox or baseball mogul if you want to see the Indians make a thousand fantasy deals. Pretty pointless constantly worrying about it.


yeah falling 2 more games behind a playoff spot at this point in the season is a free fall. its unacceptable for them to have gone worse then 4-2 on this mini road trip considering the teams they were playing.


It's hardly a "free fall" at all. Yeah, this road trip was incredibly disappointing, but you forget that baseball is a 162 games. You're going to go through high and low points in a season. It's still not quite even the end of July. It's not mid-September yet. There's still PLENTY of time to make up ground.. and we still have plenty of games against Detroit left to play as well. Geesh.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby ASUTribefan » Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:25 pm

A.Zajac wrote:
ASUTribefan wrote:
GoTribe028 wrote:
ASUTribefan wrote:ho hum another day another loss, free falling like an anchor since the ASB, but we dont need to make a move right? Laughable.


Lmao a 2-4 stretch is "free falling like an achor"?! It's not a good week, but hardly a free fall. :lol :rolleyes

Go play xbox or baseball mogul if you want to see the Indians make a thousand fantasy deals. Pretty pointless constantly worrying about it.


yeah falling 2 more games behind a playoff spot at this point in the season is a free fall. its unacceptable for them to have gone worse then 4-2 on this mini road trip considering the teams they were playing.


It's hardly a "free fall" at all. Yeah, this road trip was incredibly disappointing, but you forget that baseball is a 162 games. You're going to go through high and low points in a season. It's still not quite even the end of July. It's not mid-September yet. There's still PLENTY of time to make up ground.. and we still have plenty of games against Detroit left to play as well. Geesh.



yeah losing a series when they are must wins are free falls. They are running out of time fast to pass detroit, very hardly Plenty of time, not anywhere close. if they are more then 5 games out in 2 weeks seasons over.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby A.Zajac » Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:25 pm

ASUTribefan wrote:
A.Zajac wrote:
ASUTribefan wrote:
GoTribe028 wrote:
ASUTribefan wrote:ho hum another day another loss, free falling like an anchor since the ASB, but we dont need to make a move right? Laughable.


Lmao a 2-4 stretch is "free falling like an achor"?! It's not a good week, but hardly a free fall. :lol :rolleyes

Go play xbox or baseball mogul if you want to see the Indians make a thousand fantasy deals. Pretty pointless constantly worrying about it.


yeah falling 2 more games behind a playoff spot at this point in the season is a free fall. its unacceptable for them to have gone worse then 4-2 on this mini road trip considering the teams they were playing.


It's hardly a "free fall" at all. Yeah, this road trip was incredibly disappointing, but you forget that baseball is a 162 games. You're going to go through high and low points in a season. It's still not quite even the end of July. It's not mid-September yet. There's still PLENTY of time to make up ground.. and we still have plenty of games against Detroit left to play as well. Geesh.



yeah losing a series when they are must wins are free falls. They are running out of time fast to pass detroit, very hardly Plenty of time, not anywhere close. if they are more then 5 games out in 2 weeks seasons over.


I find it somewhat funny people label games "must wins" in the month of July. There's 61 or 62 games left. Not 20. Not 15. Not 30. Plenty of time.
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Re: 2013 MLB Trade Deadline

Postby theshow » Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:50 pm

When I look at the trade market, other than guys like Garza or Peavy (who we wont get), most the starters are likely to perform similar to a McCalister or an Ubaldo. Additionally, as weak as our bullpen has been, I feel like most the LHRP on the market aren't a guarentee either. I do like Russell from the Cubs, but at what price (Theo is good at making people overpay)?

Since there is almost not premium talent to be had without giving up Lindor, Bauer or Salazar, I honestly feel like the best move is to stand pat. If the Cardinals were willing to overpay for Asdrubal and give up controllable pitching, I think that trade would benefit us in the long run, however, I am not sure you want to send the message to the clubhouse that we are going to trade a former all star shortstop for prospects.

A couple other thoughts and questions while I am making a post

- Things could change but Kazmir is pitching his way to a lucrative contract with another team. Under the new system will we get compensation for him?

- I realize Jhonny Peralta is not that good and benefits from hitting in a stacked lineup, but why didn't we get more than Giovanni Soto for the current all-star? Also, with the disapointing defense Ascab has showed, which grades out worse than Peralta, who decided that Cabrera was a better defensive SS and Jhonny had to move to 3B? Was it just the fact that he made flashier plays?

- The way our bullpen has been with Perez, Pestano, and even Smith at times having down years, you wonder why not just trade bullpen guys when their stock is high. We could have gotten a small fortune for a Perez or Pestano a few years ago and now they have lost their value. Starters and Position players are either good or bad, but year to year bullpen guys seem like they are never consistent and who is good is primarily decided by luck.
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