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Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Talk about the Cleveland Indians, Major League Baseball, and other sports.

Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Bearcatbob » Sun Apr 22, 2012 7:00 pm

Huge bench issues.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:18 pm

dazindiansfanuk wrote:Not so good watching Lopez play defense!!

And Donald takes waaaaaaaay too much time throwing the damn ball from short.


Agree completely on Donald. Kid has a strong arm, but man it seems he takes forever to go from glove to release.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Mon Apr 23, 2012 8:50 am

dazindiansfanuk wrote:
Prosecutor wrote:Good to see Lopez getting a start at first today. I can't stand to watch Kotchman continue to hunch up at the plate and pound the ball into the dirt.


Not so good watching Lopez play defense!!

And Donald takes waaaaaaaay too much time throwing the damn ball from short.


Agree on Donald. I hold my breath every time the ball is hit to him.

Lopez dropped a ball that cost us a meaningless run. I'd still rather see him at first base than Kotchman right now, who is 0-for-12 with RISP. The guy has been a human rally killer. I guess the question is whether he saves more runs with his glove than Lopez would have driven in if he had those 12 at-bats.

It's getting frustrating watching teams continue to walk Santana, Hafner, and Duncan only to see Kotchman end the rally every single time. Hannahan should be moved up to 7th as long as he's hitting .600 with RISP.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby TonyIBI » Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:50 pm

As I said in the other thread re: Donald....

Donald is just showing the fans what evaluators and the Indians already knew: he is not a ML shortstop. Sure, playing there one a week to rest the starter is fine, but when he is out there everyday his flaws there really show. He's versatile in that he can play a lot of positions....not because he plays them well....but because he handles them and at a few position is an average defender and has an interesting bat.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:21 am

Donald has absolutely drilled left-handed pitchers the last two years. I think he should start every game that a lefty is pitching against the Tribe. They could rotate him between 2B, SS, 3B and CF to give Kipnis, Hanny, Droobs and Brantley an occasional day off while getting a potent bat in the lineup.

Now the Royals come in to town with a 3-13 record. They've only scored 57 runs, or about 3.6 per game.Three of their five starters have ERA's between 5.87 and 6.92. Left-handed hitters are tuning them up for a .825 OPS.

Now watch them sweep us.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Tue Apr 24, 2012 4:57 pm

It turns out the three pitchers set to face the Tribe are the guys with the three highest ERA's, so we catch a break by missing Bruce Chen. Also, the Royals have lost 11 straight and we're getting Asdrubal back.

So with everything going for us there's no way we win any of these games, right?
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:07 pm

Interesting lineup by Manny...

Having Kipnis leading off = ++
Droobs back in the lineup = ++
Choo
Santana
Hafner
Duncan
Hannahan = Left Switch Left Right Left makes the Loogy thing not so easy..

Kotchman has to get it going.. starting tonight..
Cunningham had some very good swings in his last game.. let's see if he can hit em where they aint..

A Beautiful Night for a baseball game at the corner of Ontario and Carnegie...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:47 am

Good win at home against a terrible team. Lowe and the bullpen pitched just well enough and Hannahan came through again with two out and RISP.

Choo tweaked a hamstring so we may see more of Cunningham. He looks OK in center field and relaxed at the plate. My early read is that he is capable of punishing a fastball in the middle of the plate, like the single to right-center last night, but good pitches get him every time. Kind of like Shelley Duncan who is cooling off quickly.

Now they get two right-handers with ERA's north of 6.00. Let's go get 'em.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Rocky55 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:41 pm

1st Place. I didn't even realize until I got home from work. A Frickin Mazing.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GhostofTedCox » Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:21 pm

This is gonna sound a little weird,,,but I feel bad for the Royals.

Don't get me wrong, I hope we sweep them. But they are a young, talented club and shouldn't be on this extended losing streak. I really expected the Royals to be much improved this season. That roster has talent.

Yost needs to do something to shake that team up. (when they leave town) Or else Yost might be just another unemployed manager - soon.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Rocky55 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:32 pm

GhostofTedCox wrote:This is gonna sound a little weird,,,but I feel bad for the Royals.

Don't get me wrong, I hope we sweep them. But they are a young, talented club and shouldn't be on this extended losing streak. I really expected the Royals to be much improved this season. That roster has talent.

Yost needs to do something to shake that team up. (when they leave town) Or else Yost might be just another unemployed manager - soon.

The pitching SUUUUUCKS. Montgomery's the only one close who could help but he isn't that good. Lamb's good & Odorizzi might be but neither helps this year. They either have to trade for or sign FA pitchers. Tough job. Don't think it's Yost's fault but he'll take the fall. I will root for them against the tigers.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:20 pm

I don't care how much the experts love the Royals farm system. I'll start taking that organization seriously once they prove they can develop more than one above average starting pitcher per decade. Since drafting Kevin Appier in the 1st round 25 years ago, I can't think of any good starting pitchers Kansas City has developed other than Zack Greinke. Jose Rosado looked like he'd be good, but injuries ended his career by age 25, and that was over a decade ago. Luke Hochevar has been awful, and yet by KC standards he's sadly one of their best.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Edible14 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:59 pm

GhostofTedCox wrote:This is gonna sound a little weird,,,but I feel bad for the Royals.

Don't get me wrong, I hope we sweep them. But they are a young, talented club and shouldn't be on this extended losing streak. I really expected the Royals to be much improved this season. That roster has talent.

Yost needs to do something to shake that team up. (when they leave town) Or else Yost might be just another unemployed manager - soon.


Interesting little tidbit. There's a site that power ranks teams by WAR wins. Kansas City, despite their lowly actual record, is the 7th best team in baseball by this metric. The Indians are 13th and the Tigers 14th by this same metric.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby ironmike » Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:29 am

For all you Duncan fans, beware. He can't cover the outside part of the plate because he is a dead pull hitter. Last nite was a great example. He had a great chance in his 3rd at bat against Hochevar with runners in scoring position to take a fastball on the outside part of the plate and drive it up the alley in RCF. Manny Ramirez would have done it. Track how many of Duncan's contacts and hits go to the right side of second base. Not good.

Duncan is a role player period. Play him against LH pitching only and as pinch hitter.

This team desperately needs an young, RH outfielder who is an impact player, if they want to win a championship.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:32 am

ironmike wrote:This team desperately needs an young, RH outfielder who is an impact player, if they want to win a championship.


Yeah, the failure of LaPorta to fill that hole as the main player in the Sabathia deal is really hurting the Tribe right now.

The emergence of Hannahan after Andy Marte washed out saved the Tribe's bacon at 3rd base, and now they need to find a guy like that for left field since they have nobody in the system unless LaPorta finally figures it out. But LaPorta is looking like a younger Shelley Duncan at this point.

They're throwing mud at the wall with the additions of players like Canzler, Cunningham, and Neal, but so far nobody has turned into the next Jack Hannahan or Casey Blake. It looks like they're resigned to using some combination of Duncan, Johnny Damon, and Grady to get them through the year and then address the left field issue in the off-season.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:23 am

LaPorta hasn't lived up to some undefined expectations in many fans eyes.. Sometimes it just takes a bit more time to truly develop the skills necessary to be a contributor at the ML level.. By going to Columbus and raking the way Matt has been, it's pretty clear he'll be one of the "next" guy brought back up to Cleveland to see if the improvement in AAA numbers are real and can be extrapolated to the ML's or if he's still in that AAAA mode.. Cord Phelps is a lot like this in many ways, however, he doesn't have the unrealistic onus of having to live up to the trade return for a two and a half month rental of a soon to be departed former Cy Young winner.. can you spell U-N-F-A-I-R expectations ????
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby TonyIBI » Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:33 am

LaPorta is pretty much done. I'd be surprised if he is in the org next year as he will be out of options and has to make the team. I guess they could show Duncan the door and keep LaPorta around in Duncan's role. At this point, though, LaPorta is probably a lost cause. His numbers at AAA are nice, but that gives no depth to how he is really playing. He is still swinging at low and away breaking balls, still striking out a lot, still trying to pull almost everything, and still unable to make pitchers pay for mistakes on hanging breaking balls. Nothing has really changed, other than he is just facing inferior pitching at AAA. Classic 4A guy. Too good for AAA, but not good enough for MLB. A guy that just gets lost in translation between AAA and MLB.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:08 pm

Still holding out hope that the Tribe may be able to get another team to bite on LaPorta with his flashy numbers in AAA. Or possibly flip him for a similar type of player (Michael Taylor, Travis Snider, etc). Probably wishful thinking though.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby ironmike » Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:23 pm

If LaPorta improves and can hit the ball to all fields they might have to give him another chance. I'd rather give LaPorta the chance than continue with Duncan.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:20 pm

ironmike wrote:If LaPorta improves and can hit the ball to all fields they might have to give him another chance. I'd rather give LaPorta the chance than continue with Duncan.


or watch Casey Kotchman flail away helplessly at any pitch thrown near the plate.. He's just not close to being what was expected when he was acquired to be the everyday 1B....
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:49 am

I've stumbled upon the # 1 problem with the Indians offense... Bases loaded situations. The Indians have loaded the bases more times in the first 16 games than I can recall, yet, the runs scored from this situation have been paltry, at best. According to Baseball Reference, the Indians have loaded the bases 20 times in the early going and have come away with 15 runs, total. This is an area that HAS to improve.

-Sacrifice flies are okay..
-GIDP's are not..
-K's are not..
Pop outs are not..

Where is the 'big hit' when it's really needed?. The Indians could easily have scored 18 to 20 more runs if this fundamental part of the offense is better..
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:06 pm

At least the White Sox and Tigers keep losing too. Tigers just got swept at home by the Mariners....ouch. That offense of the Tigers is averaging only 3.3 runs a game I believe outside of their first series against Boston. And now Delmon Young apparently decided to celebrate the anniversary of throwing his bat at an umpire by getting drunk in NY and assulting a Jew (and getting charged with a hate crime). Throw in the non-Verlander starters ERA of nearly 6 and that team has as many issues as the Tribe right now.

Nice to see Humber come back down to Earth too...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:04 pm

Bases loaded in the first inning.. hannahan watches as strike three goes by...

Bases could have been loaded in the third.. but Droobs tried Torii Hunter's arm on a sharply hit line drive by Carlos Santana with two on.. and was gunned down at home by 20 feet.. smh.. Hunter always kills the Indians..

The good news.. Masterson appears to be settling into a very nice pattern in this game.. lots of movement and throwing all his pitches...

Come on Tribe..let's score some runs !!..
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:23 pm

Going after Pujols with the go-ahead run in scoring position in the 8th? Ballsy, but love it. Great to see from Masterson with a solid outing.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Edible14 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:42 pm

Great game by Masterson. A breath-taking relief performance from Vinnie Pestano. Some good hitting all around the lineup, and a great finish. Love that tribe!
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby TonyIBI » Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:22 am

That slider by Pestano has really developed into a weapon for him. That last strike to Aybar was SICK. Guy had no chance.

Big win against the Angels. Now at least win one of the games on Sat/Sun and win a series.....and send Albert out of town still homerless.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby criznit2009 » Sat Apr 28, 2012 7:56 am

In 1st place... Again - just likely last year and oddly enough hopefully not a repeat of last years final standings...

Brantley is clearly suffering in the lead off role but hasn't completely disintegrated. if Choo wasn't hurt, I think Kipnis would be there myself. Scoring runs for this team hasn't been easy, but they are duking it out for now. Kipnis really shoud be batting lead-off until Choo and Hafner should be batting third. I can see moving him up from the 5th hole, but don't see how his value increases in the clean-up spot. He gets on base and batting behind, Kip and Acab (for now) gets Acab a lot of pitches to work with. Any way once Choo is fully back, I think a line-up of this looks pretty good ( Acta's then mine)

Kipnis/Choo - I go with Choo myself. OBP and base path havok REQUIRED.
Acab/Kipnis - I go with Kipnis.
Choo/Hafner - I go with PRONK, but Acta prolly goes with Choo
Hafner/Santana - maybe Choo here??? I stay with Santana.
Santana/Acab - Yes I drop Acab to the 5th hole. - All I know is I get both Hafner and Kip batting somewhere 1-2-3 starting NOW. The other guy is either Choo or Acab. So you could have Acab batting lead-off and Choo here and I would like that as well.
Duncan/Damon - from here it gets even MORE interchangeable except for Brantley at the bottom. If Kotchman starts hittting I have him here.
Hannahan/Damon
Kotchman/Hanny
Brantley

Also it seems to me when PRONK was at his best, he was batting 3rd................

Good start - align those bats and hope Tomlin, Lowe, Ubaldo and Gomez can hang on and we have a great season in the making.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:41 pm

Choo still out of the lineup.. A good idea if there's even a hint that his hamstring is an issue. Smart move by Manny..

Looking forward to seeing how JeanMar pitches today.. It could be his "unveiling" to the rest of the ML's if he has his usual outing..

It would be a nice day for Shelly to bust out of his slump.. not expecting it, though...

Lets score some runs !!...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:04 pm

They are currently aiming for a 3:30 start... Fox should be switching over for everyone in the coverage area.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Sat Apr 28, 2012 5:30 pm

JeanMar pitched pretty well.. that slider/cutter he's throwing can be devastating...

Torii Hunter got us again.. that guy just kills the Indians...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GhostofTedCox » Sat Apr 28, 2012 6:35 pm

As everybody knows by now, Bobby Abreu is now a FA. At one point, The Indians had a serious interest in acquiring him.
Compensation, player and contract, are no longer an issue. We would have to convince him to sign with us. But that's about all.

However, we will soon have Damon as LF/DH. Does that mean we shouldn't pursue Abreu? Only 2 Indians had more hits than Abreu last season. He also is close to the 2,500 hit milestone. Choo isn't showing much recovery this season.

:biggrin Later this season, you could imagine an Indians all-star outfield of Damon, Sizemore, and Abreu (after a few drinks).
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:12 am

The reason the Indians have so many bases loaded situations is that teams have been walking the hell out of Santana, Hafner, and even Duncan to get to the bottom of the order. It's amazing the Tribe is in first place despite zero production from first base. How much longer can they watch Kotchman hit .143 with no walks or power and kill rally after rally without giving LaPorta one last shot? Kotchman is 0-for-14 with RISP.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby ironmike » Sun Apr 29, 2012 8:35 am

Tori Hunter is a professional hitter. Both HR's this weekend on pitches out over the plate, the very same pitches Duncan can't touch. Did we knock Hunter on his ass or establish the inside part of the plate in any of his AB's?

Truthfully, I can't stand to watch Duncan play, he might fool some of you, but not me.

This team needs an impact RH hitter if they want to contend.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:07 pm

Torii wore the crown the first two games.. but the goat horns today.. Nice to see the Indians add on late in the game & superb performances by Lowe to keep the Angels off balance, Pestano to blow away the threat and The Rage to slam the door with some swagger...

BTW.. Kotchman's "ripped" fly out to RF late in the game was the best swing he's put on a pitch in close to two weeks. On a warmer less unfriendly wind situation, that ball would have gotten allllllll the way to the warning track. He had some pretty nasty foul balls, too...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:07 am

Yeah, and he lined a single to left the previous at-bat. That's two line drives in one game - a huge leap forward. Maybe he'll finally start making solid contact. He's a .265 career hitter so he's got to start hitting at some point.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:52 am

Prosecutor wrote:Yeah, and he lined a single to left the previous at-bat. That's two line drives in one game - a huge leap forward. Maybe he'll finally start making solid contact. He's a .265 career hitter so he's got to start hitting at some point.


Yes, it was a solid hit going the other way.. but you can see from the slowed down replay that Kotchman was fooled on the pitch, but, kept his hands back just enough & continued to track it deep into the strike zone before making contact. Sometimes it's a 'fooled' opposite field hit or a bloop or a fisted hit that gives a player the confidence to start stringing good at bats together. This may be the case with Casey.. He needs it now..

On another note.. The Indians accomplished exactly what they needed to with respect to putting the Angels to sleep at the plate. The pitching staff allowed a total of four runs over the three game weekend series. Sunday's crowd wasn't exactly what I'd call energizing or electric. We enjoyed our day at the corner of Carnegie and Ontario.. Day off today before a really tough part of the schedule begins.. The Indians have 10 games scheduled over the next nine days and 21 games over the next 20 days including two series with the Pale Hose sandwiched around a visit by the Rangers this coming week & weekend..
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:56 pm

Odd factoid: As of Tuesday, the Indians will have as many members of the 2004 Red Sox on their roster (Damon, Lowe) as Boston (Ortiz, Youkilis).
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GhostofTedCox » Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:01 pm

Pork Chop Pough wrote:Odd factoid: As of Tuesday, the Indians will have as many members of the 2004 Red Sox on their roster (Damon, Lowe) as Boston (Ortiz, Youkilis).


Wow! I don't know if that says more about the Indians or the Red Sox.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue May 01, 2012 8:30 am

April 2012 has seen the Indians emerge as the holders of first place in the division, (now six days) with both the CWSox and Detroit Tigers one game behind.. An 11-9 record for the month is two games behind (13-7) last year's "great start". But what has changed from last year..

In 2011, the Indians lost two of three to open the season, then went on an 8 game winning streak. After the sixth game of the season, the Indians took over first place in the division and held onto it for most summer, nearly 100 days, until a four game losing streak in late July put them in second place to stay.. The Indians took over first place in the AL Central on April 24th with strong a strong bullpen, underrated starting pitching, an infield that is producing both offensively and defensively. The primary area of 'concern' is the outfield. The Indians outfield hasn't been as bad as Chicago's (Viciedo/De Aza/Rios.. of these three, only Rios is actually hitting the ball with some regularity) while Detroit has just lost its starting LF'er (Delmon "Zieg Heil" Young) to ignorance.

The White Sox have three hitters in their lineup, possibly four if you include De Aza and his .247 BA. Otherwise, the CWSox are a HORRIBLE offensive team. Ahh.. but therein lies the key: Konerko and Pierzynski.. The Indians pitchers cannot let "Paulie" and his big bat beat us.. Stop Paulie, and a two out of three "W" for the series should be in hand...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Prosecutor » Tue May 01, 2012 9:17 am

Day off today before a really tough part of the schedule begins.. The Indians have 10 games scheduled over the next nine days and 21 games over the next 20 days including two series with the Pale Hose sandwiched around a visit by the Rangers this coming week & weekend..


Not too sure about that, Chief. As I see it, the Tribe plays 29 games in May, only three of which are against a team that is currently over .500 (Texas).

They have yet to play a single game against a team with a winning record as of today's standings. The A.L. Central is shaping up to be a very weak division. In fact, between the Central and the West there are only two teams over .500, and the Tribe is just 11-9. It looks like all the power is in the East, except for Texas.

Even the interleague schedule looks pretty soft with series against St. Louis, Cincy, PIttsburgh, and Houston. Only the Cardinals are over .500.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue May 01, 2012 10:40 am

-I was referring to the x-number of games in x-1 days...

-Couldn't agree with you more on the Interleague schedule save for the defending World Series Champs.. They are pitching and hitting and playing as a team that knows how to win.. They will be a ROUGH opponent..

-With the promotion of Johnny Damon to the squad, it looks like Jose Lopez and his 40 man roster spot is toast. Aaron Cunningham was (past tense) the initial target, however, his defense, speed and hitting has been a pleasant surprise. He may hang onto his roster spot for the time being.. To no one's surprise, Shelly Duncan's performance as an every day player seems to have hit a wall. It's always about what have you done for me lately that matters.. and it's starting to matter more and more..

-Matt LaPorta is just flat out raking in AAA. This isn't the first time he's done this. Isn't it time to say hello to Mr LaPorta in a Tribe uni soon, especially since Casey Kotchman hasn't done squadooooshe since being named the starting 1B?.. Sure..it's only a month into the season, but a 12-8, 13-7 or 14-6 record as opposed to 11-9 would be nicer..
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Edible14 » Tue May 01, 2012 12:20 pm

It's been one month. Kotchman has a decent enough track record and enough invested in him to stick around until at least June. If LaPorta is still striking out a ton, can't hit breaking balls, not walking, and trying to pull everything as reported... I have exactly zero faith that he'll actually be an upgrade over Kotchman, whose defense is at least a known quantity.

My personal preference at this point is to wait and see on Kotchman, maybe having Duncan switch in at 1B every once and awhile. If Kotchman hasn't turned it around by June and the Indians are still in it, then give LaPorta a shot. If that fizzles as expected, then perhaps by the trade deadline we can try for someone like Carlos Lee.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue May 01, 2012 12:23 pm

Prosecutor wrote:Even the interleague schedule looks pretty soft with series against St. Louis, Cincy, PIttsburgh, and Houston. Only the Cardinals are over .500.


And the Marlins this month who have been a disappointment so far. Do think the Reds are gonna be a tough matchup though (are .500).
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue May 01, 2012 12:26 pm

GeronimoSon wrote:-Matt LaPorta is just flat out raking in AAA. This isn't the first time he's done this. Isn't it time to say hello to Mr LaPorta in a Tribe uni soon, especially since Casey Kotchman hasn't done squadooooshe since being named the starting 1B?.. Sure..it's only a month into the season, but a 12-8, 13-7 or 14-6 record as opposed to 11-9 would be nicer..


LaPorta probably doesn't add a single win to this club over Kotchman, let alone 2 or 3. While Kotchman has hit very poorly (opening day was just painful to watch), he has saved the Indians several times with his defense at 1B. Any extra offense we would have gotten from LaPorta would have been wiped out by his defense.

Kotchman does need to pick it up though offensively, no question there.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue May 01, 2012 12:46 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
GeronimoSon wrote:-Matt LaPorta is just flat out raking in AAA. This isn't the first time he's done this. Isn't it time to say hello to Mr LaPorta in a Tribe uni soon, especially since Casey Kotchman hasn't done squadooooshe since being named the starting 1B?.. Sure..it's only a month into the season, but a 12-8, 13-7 or 14-6 record as opposed to 11-9 would be nicer..


LaPorta probably doesn't add a single win to this club over Kotchman, let alone 2 or 3. While Kotchman has hit very poorly (opening day was just painful to watch), he has saved the Indians several times with his defense at 1B. Any extra offense we would have gotten from LaPorta would have been wiped out by his defense.

Kotchman does need to pick it up though offensively, no question there.


W/R to LaPorta and WAR.. it could be better or worse in the ML's.. we won't know until he returns..

W/R to Kotchman's defense.. reputation has a way of sullying what is actually happening on the field.. Kotchman's defense isn't better than it allegedly was last year.. if ANYTHING, he's lost range on getting to balls. I'd be curious to see how his UZR and UZR/150 are trending after 20 games. It's just that he's being pulled off the bag more, he's not giving up the ball to the 2B so he can get back to 1B like a "GOOD" defensive 1B does & he's not "lighting up the defense" on balls hit down the line or to his right... In short.. he isn't saving squat..

W/R to LaPorta chasing balls off the plate, not hitting to the opposite field, etc. Inaccurate and presumptive..
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue May 01, 2012 12:55 pm

GeronimoSon wrote:W/R to LaPorta and WAR.. it could be better or worse in the ML's.. we won't know until he returns..

W/R to Kotchman's defense.. reputation has a way of sullying what is actually happening on the field.. Kotchman's defense isn't better than it allegedly was last year.. if ANYTHING, he's lost range on getting to balls. I'd be curious to see how his UZR and UZR/150 are trending after 20 games. It's just that he's being pulled off the bag more, he's not giving up the ball to the 2B so he can get back to 1B like a "GOOD" defensive 1B does & he's not "lighting up the defense" on balls hit down the line or to his right... In short.. he isn't saving squat..

W/R to LaPorta chasing balls off the plate, not hitting to the opposite field, etc. Inaccurate and presumptive..


Wasn't referring to WAR or anything, simply an eye test with LaPorta. Has hit ok in Cbus but doesn't look any better defensively.

And with Kotchman it's again simply an eye test. He's VASTLY superior to LaPorta at 1B. It's like comparing a high school freshman to a MLer almost it's so night and day. Kotchman has saved infielders several errors already this year digging balls out of the dirt. Never said Kotchman should be winning any gold gloves and not comparing him to how he has played in the past...simply much, much better than LaPorta, and has done well saving errors/outs. If you don't see that, well can't help ya.
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue May 01, 2012 2:37 pm

No help is asked for or needed..

Any ML team that is carrying a player with a .149 BA into the second hundred at bats while not opening your eyes defensively is a guy you don't want on your team.. The Indians have to make a decision on this guy.. It's pretty clear right now.. He's not the defensive stalwart/run saving/.300 hitting guy they thought they were getting. They got Luis Valbuena playing first base.. Even Valbuena hit one every now and then...
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby daingean » Tue May 01, 2012 3:16 pm

I'm not a fan of Kotchman by any means (and have said so) but he has been a superior defender compared to who the Indians have rolled out there in recent years. Now he's not a great defender but better than a lot. There is value for a guy that saves runs with his glove but to accept a .494 OPS for a 1B is not where I would go. I know it's early but I think the Indians are going to get closer to the .616 OPS he had in Seattle in '10 than the .800 OPS he had last year. Unfortunately, this team doesn't have a ML 1B to replace him at the moment. Sure at AAA you have LaPorta, Mills, Canzler... but LaPorta hasn't proven anything at the ML level and the Tribe is shelling out $3mill for the .494 OPS so I don't think they will be bringing up LaPorta this month but if Kotchman is sucking still come June 1, that's when you will probably see a move.

Not much available out there at the moment. Maybe a Casey Blake
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue May 01, 2012 6:16 pm

daingean wrote:I'm not a fan of Kotchman by any means (and have said so) but he has been a superior defender compared to who the Indians have rolled out there in recent years. Now he's not a great defender but better than a lot. There is value for a guy that saves runs with his glove but to accept a .494 OPS for a 1B is not where I would go. I know it's early but I think the Indians are going to get closer to the .616 OPS he had in Seattle in '10 than the .800 OPS he had last year. Unfortunately, this team doesn't have a ML 1B to replace him at the moment. Sure at AAA you have LaPorta, Mills, Canzler... but LaPorta hasn't proven anything at the ML level and the Tribe is shelling out $3mill for the .494 OPS so I don't think they will be bringing up LaPorta this month but if Kotchman is sucking still come June 1, that's when you will probably see a move.

Not much available out there at the moment. Maybe a Casey Blake


Very well could be right on us getting the 2010 version vs 2011 version of Kotchman...

But his walk rate is actually better than it was in 2011 and K-rate is nearly identical. Only real difference to this point has been a near 200 pt drop in BABIP. While Kotchman is slow so you'd expect a lower BABIP, I just don't think you'll see a .143 BABIP continue for the rest of the year. Hell, even in 2010 when he was terrible in Seattle he managed a .229 BABIP. Some of these balls are going to go for hits after a while. May only end up hitting like .240-.250 but if the walk rate continues, could end up with a .340-.350 OBP.

Only making $3M though so definitely a spot that Tribe should (and likely is) look to upgrade this summer if they are in the race. Agree nothing on the market now (I'd take Kotchman 8 days a week over Blake right now even).
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Re: Official 2012 Cleveland Indians game thread

Postby GhostofTedCox » Tue May 01, 2012 6:58 pm

Does anybody know anything about Tyler Graham? He was DFA'd by the Giants.

He must be a AAAA player as he's been in AAA the past 4 seasons.
However:
- had 60 SB last year; .337 OBP
- he plays CF
- he bats RH

Probably played with Thomas Neal.

Worth a flyer? Not a position of strength.
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