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MLB Hot Stove

Talk about the Cleveland Indians, Major League Baseball, and other sports.

Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:51 am

homerawayfromhome wrote:GSon,

I think I was one of a cpl people who mentioned the quietness surrounding CPerez. It's not quiet true, the mkt has not been totally quiet. The Giants have re-expressed interest in Perez but they really. Don't have the prospects near ready at the major league level unless the Tribe settled for Gary Brown and one of their young arms in Kyle Crick or Clayton Blackburn who are both 2/3 yrs away. Brown simply isn't overwhelming as a prospect.

I have heard the Phillies have looked at possibly acq. Perez to couple with Papelbon for a shutdown pen. I think it may have been mere speculation though. I could see them trying to acq. Pestano, which seems a more realistic option.

The Red Sox have Andrew Bailey but could take a look at Perez bc of the 2 yrs of control for the AS Closer and the need to solidify their pen. I could see the Tribe trying to acq. Andrew Bailey in return for a cheaper option with a prospect like Allen Webster coming back to the Tribe. Bailey has had some injury concerns too which could

Also, the Yankees could be looking for another closing option with Mariano Rivera recovering from ACL injury and Rafael Soriano being a FA. A cpl names to consider if the Tribe and Yanx were to engage in trade talks... Gary Sanchez-C, Mason Williams-OF, Slade Heathcott-OF and Tyler Austin-OF. Although the Yanks have David Robertson and David Aardsma as in house options.

The Tigers could be a team that comes calling at some point, in fact I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they already have made an inquiry or two on Chris Perez. IF the Tigers do come calling the price should be extensive for the divisional foe. A few names the Tribe could try to squeeze out of the Tigers: Nick Castellanos, Casey Crosby, Bruce Rondon and Asavail Garcia.

There are other teams I could see jump in on Perez too like the Mets or even the Dodgers who have depth but also want an AS at every position. It's not as if the Tribe has to move Perez with 2 yrs of control I think now or the trade deadline would be ideal to maximize Perez's value for the Tribe.


-Oh, I didn't go back and read through the comments, but it was stated with a cogent argument & I agreed with it.

-With respect to Bailey, the only Bailey the Indians should consider is Homer, not the closer for the Red Sox, imho. In addition to the right Bailey as part of the return (not Mike Leake), the Reds have a need for a lead off hitter, preferably an OF'er/CF'er and have the reverse trade of Brandon Phillips in Didi Gregorius as part of the compensation. I would love to see the Indians work a trade with the Reds where Bailey and Gregorius come to the North Coast...

-Add Austin Aune to the Yankee prospects you've listed. The NYY's are definitely someone the Indians could match up with as a trading partner.. most likely at the deadline, but before ST starts as well...

-W/R to the Tigers, both Garcia and Rondon make a LOT of sense.. I'd make that trade right now if offered and hope the hype around Rondon has some truth to it.. From what I've seen of him, he can be called Senor Smoke II !. He is a legit RP with a lightening bolt for an arm.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:57 am

OhioBaseball wrote:Random throw-in comment; regarding the Arizona trade talks, they've got a supplemental 1st round pick that is able to be traded. I think the 20th to 40th overall section of the upcoming draft is a real sweet spot of the talent pool. I'd like to see Cleveland try to swap their 2nd round supplemental pick for a 1st round pick if possible (or just straight up acquired without giving up the 2nd supplemental), whether it be Arizona or some other team. There's both some college guys and high school guys that look like they will be available there. It's a shame the Indians didn't get a 1st supplemental pick the drawing.

Obviously, I want tangible talent right now over rights to sign a player (draft pick), so it'd be a sweetener kind of thing, but I'd try to make it happen.


I would figure that has come up in talks. Would be a sort of PTBNL that could allow Arizona to keep a player out of any potential deals.

Tony tweeted about it earlier this morning, on MLBNetwork Rosenthal and Gammons were on "Hot Stove" and mentioned that Arizona and Cleveland are still talking, but only for a deal involving themselves and no outsiders (Perhaps that is exactly what Tampa and KC did this past weekend).

@TonyIPI: According to @pgammo & @Ken_Rosenthal on MLB Network, the #Indians & #DBacks still talking Cabrera. Talking 2-team deal, no 3-way trade.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:03 am

homerawayfromhome wrote:Scott Hairston is a quiet producer, probably lands something like 2yrs / $8 M with an option for a 3rd yr. could see him get something like Jeff Keppinger 3 yrs / $12 M. I like Hairston and would prefer to see the Tribe land both Hairston and Ross if Swisher is a no go...which seems to be the case.

Btw, Ken Rosenthal says Tribe and Dbax still talking ACab deal (2 team deal).


I would prefer, in this order, Swisher, Edwin Jackson, Ross, Hairston.

Looks like Swisher is becoming more of a long shot rather than his last resort. Ross & Hairston would both be usefull against lefties and can at least play all three OF spots. So either would be fantastic fits.

I wouldn't mind seeing Jackson added into the rotation that needs innings and potential. When I say potential, I don't mean I see Jackson evolving into a #1 but he has the stuff and durability to be a workhorse. Something I'm not even sure Ubaldo has left in him.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:42 am

OhioBaseball wrote:Random throw-in comment; regarding the Arizona trade talks, they've got a supplemental 1st round pick that is able to be traded. I think the 20th to 40th overall section of the upcoming draft is a real sweet spot of the talent pool. I'd like to see Cleveland try to swap their 2nd round supplemental pick for a 1st round pick if possible (or just straight up acquired without giving up the 2nd supplemental), whether it be Arizona or some other team. There's both some college guys and high school guys that look like they will be available there. It's a shame the Indians didn't get a 1st supplemental pick the drawing.

Obviously, I want tangible talent right now over rights to sign a player (draft pick), so it'd be a sweetener kind of thing, but I'd try to make it happen.


Good call. I would try to acquire it without giving up our supplemental pick. Having two supplemental picks should add a lot to our draft cap. We may have the money that other teams do not to sign high profile guys that slip a bit.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:52 am

Ohio Baseball, good call...

I didn't realize the Dbax got a competitive balance pk but I think its a great idea if the Tribe tries to acq. the pk. Either as a swap of pks or for the Pk (prefered) It's not tradable until the season but could be added to a deal as future considerations.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:56 pm

At CBS Sports, the other guy,Matt Snyder ( http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/eye-o ... er-for-now : not heyman or knobbler), says the Rays are definitely looking at doing something about their offense as it's just not there yet. He mentions Hafner and Thome and Ibanez (all left handed) and says, the Rays have to do something until Wil Myers is actually ready for the ML's, which should be sometime in June.. About when teams are beginning to discuss trading deadline deals. Wouldn't it just be exactly what the Indians would be/should be doing if their season starts off poorly??

SSChoo to the Rays as an OF'er (certainly better than Matt Joyce) and DH for the 2013 season. Trade him at the deadline to acquire more prospects that feed the Rays system. Makes waaaay too much sense & would be following the blueprint the Rays have set for themselves over the last few years....
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:57 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:Ohio Baseball, good call...

I didn't realize the Dbax got a competitive balance pk but I think its a great idea if the Tribe tries to acq. the pk. Either as a swap of pks or for the Pk (prefered) It's not tradable until the season but could be added to a deal as future considerations.

More picks..more high picks.. more chance for the Indians to add a "WIN" to their draft tally.. The aggregation of funds for drafts, can't hurt, either.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:24 pm

GeronimoSon wrote:Another factor to consider is the fallout from the Royals/Rays trade. The Royals absolutely won the short term value from this trade. No doubt about it. No way it can be interpreted as anything other than the Royals got exactly what they were looking for & will begin the 2013 season as a MUCH better team, because of it. The long term results are a LOT murkier, but that's for something to worry about at some future date..

The Rays severely weakened their starting pitching staff by yanking, not one, but TWO SP's from their rotation including their staff ace, James Shields. Say what you will about the beast that David Price has become, but he was taking the ball in the second game of the series, not the first which was reserved for James Shields. Wade Davis was a versatile pitcher who could work out of the pen or work as a starter. He will be missed as well, if, for no other reason than he added to the depth of starting pitchers the Rays had at their disposal.

I DON'T THINK THE RAYS ARE DONE.. The Rays dropped nearly $ 12 MM in payroll from their roster in acquiring this group of kids and now have a bloated bank account and at least two holes (three to be honest) to fill: OF'er, Shortstop and #3 SP.. hmm who has a SS and a # 3 SP to trade and just got a haul of prospects to trade and a bank account to pay for some if not all of their projected acquisition? Oh, and the guys they acquire are going to be short term acquisitions, no big deal if they're one and done. While it could be speculated that three way trade the Rays were mentioned in, could still be valid, but maybe not and maybe not now. The Rays have learned that if they want to get something done, they have to do it themselves. The Rays & Indians are getting pretty tired of Texas gumming up the works and could make a deal that excludes the Texas two-stepping nonsense? The question becomes, what could it be?.

Any ideas?


Rays don't have a hole at SS as they traded for Escobar. Don't really see a hole in their #3 spot of the rotation either, as Matt Moore and Hellickson should be able to slot into the #2 and #3 slots with Cobb at 4 and Niemann, Archer, and Odorizzi in the 5. The Rays did not yank 2 SPs from their rotation as Davis only pitched out of the bullpen last year and likely would have again.

Agree on them needing an outfielder though. Choo still makes sense for them IMO. Yeah only one year left but would fit nicely in the leadoff spot ahead of Zobrist and Longoria (Jennings has been mentioned there but only a .314 OBP last year). Allows them to keep Myers in AAA to start the year as well (to get an extra year service time) and still have a DH spot open for Myers to take when he's ready (or move Joyce there). Could argue Cabrera is still a fit even with Escobar as AC could slide into 2B and move Zobrist to the OF full-time. Think that would be a pretty bold move for the Rays, though think it's a long-shot. Still have the pitching depth as you mentioned to go after either player though if they wanted.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:38 pm

Rocky55 wrote:
GoTribe028 wrote:Paul Hoynes first reported this, Buster Olney also brought it up FWIW

Apparently, the trade for Asdrubal Cabrera that didn't go through, that would have netted the Indians "a ML pitcher and 2 high level prospects" while the trade partner would have changed Cabrera's postition, was the Phillies. Phillie reportedly offered Vance Worley and the 2 prospects and Cleveland asked for more before they both moved on.

http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index.ss ... ookin.html

Hard to comment without knowing who the two "high level prospects" were. If it was Worley, jesse Biddle & Trevor May, they effed up. I'd bet it wasn't those two. The Phillies don't "lose" trades. May is a K monster (and a BB monster), and should be at least a #3 & I like Biddle, who should be pitching in AA as a 21 yr old, even better.

Too bad we don't know the players involved.


I agree, would be interesting to see what prospects were offered/asked for. While I like May and Biddle a lot too, not sure either will be an Ace, like Bauer could be, so may be why we asked for so much. Then again, we reportedly liked Skaggs a lot too, and I don't think Skaggs will be an Ace either, so who knows. I agree it probably wasn't both of them (probably one or the other) with one of their catcher specs as well. Disagree a bit that the Phillies don't "lose" trades though. The Cliff Lee to Seattle trade was a big loss for the Phillies IMO (even though they signed him a year later). After the postseason he had, they needed to get a lot more than what they got.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Rocky55 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:50 pm

GoTribe028 wrote:
OhioBaseball wrote:Random throw-in comment; regarding the Arizona trade talks, they've got a supplemental 1st round pick that is able to be traded. I think the 20th to 40th overall section of the upcoming draft is a real sweet spot of the talent pool. I'd like to see Cleveland try to swap their 2nd round supplemental pick for a 1st round pick if possible (or just straight up acquired without giving up the 2nd supplemental), whether it be Arizona or some other team. There's both some college guys and high school guys that look like they will be available there. It's a shame the Indians didn't get a 1st supplemental pick the drawing.

Obviously, I want tangible talent right now over rights to sign a player (draft pick), so it'd be a sweetener kind of thing, but I'd try to make it happen.


I would figure that has come up in talks. Would be a sort of PTBNL that could allow Arizona to keep a player out of any potential deals.

Tony tweeted about it earlier this morning, on MLBNetwork Rosenthal and Gammons were on "Hot Stove" and mentioned that Arizona and Cleveland are still talking, but only for a deal involving themselves and no outsiders (Perhaps that is exactly what Tampa and KC did this past weekend).

@TonyIPI: According to @pgammo & @Ken_Rosenthal on MLB Network, the #Indians & #DBacks still talking Cabrera. Talking 2-team deal, no 3-way trade.

Thank God they're done with that 5 team crap. We should have been dealing with AZ face to face a long time ago. Texas can go after Upton on their own.

I noticed Corbin's name quoted in a post & the original mention of this trade was on one of Paulie C's "Lazy Sunday" posts in August. The package he suggested was Corbin & Skaggs for Asdrubal & I'd do that right now. If it included OB's swap of CB draft picks, so much the better. Of course I'd prefer Bauer & Skaggs as Corbin is probably a #3 at best. His WHIP is hit driven as he doesn't walk anybody. How about one of Bauer/Skaggs + Corbin + the CB pick swap. Is that enough?
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:59 pm

The Hoynes piling on stuff.. is typical Hoynes..

They were talking..
They wanted...
..to sweeten the deal.. etc. etc..

Question: Who was talking? Wasn't Ruben Amaro.. or Chris Antonetti.. sure as hell wasn't Mark Shapiro. No indication that Terry Francona or Charlie Manuel uttered a word..

NOTHING. no reference..pure conjecture.. the appearance of facts in evidence without the actual presence of facts.. Not unusual for a Hoynes article.. BTW...next report about this or any trade.. will be a scathing rebuke about whey the Indians didn't make this trade..
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:21 pm

Rocky55,

I make the deal right now. If the Tribe can land Bauer, Corbin and future considerations (and swap the competitive balance lottery pk). Furthermore I'd make the trade right now for Archie Bradley, Patrick Corbin and future considerations (the rights to AZ comp. pk --- no swapping of pks).

IF the Tribe backs down from their demand for Bauer and Skaggs it should be only with the inclusion of the Dbax comp pk, IMO and the inclusion of one of the two. Btw, I'm not sure the Dbax would include both lefties Skaggs and Corbin in the deal, which could be one of their concerns.

A few other names in their minor league system I wouldn't mind seeing the Tribe land...
Archie Bradley
Matt Davidson
Andrew Chafin
David Holmberg
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Rocky55 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:44 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:Rocky55,

I make the deal right now. If the Tribe can land Bauer, Corbin and future considerations (and swap the competitive balance lottery pk). Furthermore I'd make the trade right now for Archie Bradley, Patrick Corbin and future considerations (the rights to AZ comp. pk --- no swapping of pks).

IF the Tribe backs down from their demand for Bauer and Skaggs it should be only with the inclusion of the Dbax comp pk, IMO and the inclusion of one of the two. Btw, I'm not sure the Dbax would include both lefties Skaggs and Corbin in the deal, which could be one of their concerns.

A few other names in their minor league system I wouldn't mind seeing the Tribe land...
Archie Bradley
Matt Davidson
Andrew Chafin
David Holmberg

I liked the Skaggs/Corbin combo because they were both lefties. We need them.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Rocky55 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:47 pm

Should have added that we don't need two lefties in this specific deal as we could score one for Choo. Have a hard time imagining that whoever that was would be better than Corbin but who knows?
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:01 pm

The RayS have some young arms the Tribe could look to land. I would not be surprised to see the Tribe and Rays hook up considering the proposed mega deal had the Tribe sending Choo to TB and Chris Archer coming back to the Tribe. I'm not sure the Rays would want to move an arm close to their rotation after moving Shields and swing pitcher Wade Davis. But they have some interesting arms nonetheless here's a few prospects the Tribe could look to score from the Rays if they worked out a deal for Choo.
Mike Montgomery-LHSP
Enny Romero-LHSP
Alex Colome-RHSP
Blake Snell-LHSP
Felipe Rivero-LHSP
If the Tribe could land two of these guys I'd consider it a solid pkg in return for Choo.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:28 pm

Jayson Stark says the Pirates were potentially part of four team deal that would send Choo to the Pirates. Another note he reports Pirates are shopping Joel Hanrahan and the Dodgers and Tigers are interested. Pirates reportedly have interest in Chris Capauno.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:07 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:Jayson Stark says the Pirates were potentially part of four team deal that would send Choo to the Pirates. Another note he reports Pirates are shopping Joel Hanrahan and the Dodgers and Tigers are interested. Pirates reportedly have interest in Chris Capauno.


The Pirates would be a good trading partner for the Indians.. They have a bunch of c-OF'ers that are of interest and some pretty amazing arms.. Maybe the reverse of the Brian Giles for Ricardo Rincon trade could be visited upon Chris Antonetti and the Indians?...
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:39 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:Rocky55,

I make the deal right now. If the Tribe can land Bauer, Corbin and future considerations (and swap the competitive balance lottery pk). Furthermore I'd make the trade right now for Archie Bradley, Patrick Corbin and future considerations (the rights to AZ comp. pk --- no swapping of pks).

IF the Tribe backs down from their demand for Bauer and Skaggs it should be only with the inclusion of the Dbax comp pk, IMO and the inclusion of one of the two. Btw, I'm not sure the Dbax would include both lefties Skaggs and Corbin in the deal, which could be one of their concerns.

A few other names in their minor league system I wouldn't mind seeing the Tribe land...
Archie Bradley
Matt Davidson
Andrew Chafin
David Holmberg


Agree. Corbin-Bradley-1st Round Comp pick would do it for me. Bradley could end up better than both of Bauer/Skaggs, and Corbin is a major leaguer. I love the thought of adding to our draft funds though. Does anyone know how much extra money you get for a first round comp pick. It would have to be around a million, right? With the new draft system, I don't think it is so much where you pick, it is gonna be who has the remaining cash to make an offer to a player who is sitting somewhere he should not be. Also, are these competitive balance picks protected? I am under the impression they are not, and would imagine we would take a 'safe' sign and use a protected second round pick to try to sign someone way over slot.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:59 pm

Uhoh....Geronimoson....

@DKnobler: Reds deep in talks on deal to acquire Shin-soo Choo from Indians for Stubbs and Gregorius. http://t.co/taSdvt2X
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:07 pm

Gotta say I hope the deal gets done. Stubbs needs the change of scenery and Gregorius is a top flight SS prospect. CA make the move.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:11 pm

GoTribe028 wrote:Uhoh....Geronimoson....

@DKnobler: Reds deep in talks on deal to acquire Shin-soo Choo from Indians for Stubbs and Gregorius. http://t.co/taSdvt2X


If there's any truth to this rumor, then Asdrubal to the DBax probably won't be too far behind..

Hate the inclusion of Drew Stubbs..putting him together with Mark Reynolds and the Indians would have a pair of guys what would challenge the ALL TIME K-RATE for two players on the same team. It would be MUCH nicer to see one of the Reds deep prospects like Amir Garrett or Vaughn Covington can be added..but, it will depend on how the Reds and Indians view the "value" brought or subtracted by the inclusion of Stubbs (IMHO, adding stubbs makes the return worse)..
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:22 pm

A lot of reports flying out about this deal. It looks like Stubbs and Gregorious for Choo & "another player"
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:23 pm

FWIW

@Ken_Rosenthal: Rival execs say #Diamondbacks GM Towers loves Gregorius. RT @jonmorosi: Also possible #Indians would keep Cabrera and trade Gregorius.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:24 pm

I like Stubbs he's gotta a lot of talent which is obvious hopefully it's a matter of change that resurrects his career.
Gregorius is the real return in the trade. But is makes me wonder 1. who else would go to cinci in that deal. 2. Why are the Indians so insistent upon adding another SS? Makes me wonder if Lindor could be moving to AZ too...
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:31 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:I like Stubbs he's gotta a lot of talent which is obvious hopefully it's a matter of change that resurrects his career.
Gregorius is the real return in the trade. But is makes me wonder 1. who else would go to cinci in that deal. 2. Why are the Indians so insistent upon adding another SS? Makes me wonder if Lindor could be moving to AZ too...


I would like to think of it as Gregorius and Acab both going instead of Lindor and Acab. Agree With GSon tho, say no to Stubbs. Give me young, high upside pitching prospect.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:33 pm

The stove is getting hot hot hot hot again. Im gonna start freaking out.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:37 pm

Brian,
You could be right. It could be a one for one type deal though, the Tribe flipping Gregorius for Bauer or Skaggs. I like Stubbs good talent maybe the Tribe pushes him down the lineup and takes pressure off of him to produce. Hopefully the player the other player the Tribe is moving is someone that won't hurt like Lars Anderson. :)
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:43 pm

GoTribe028 wrote:FWIW

@Ken_Rosenthal: Rival execs say #Diamondbacks GM Towers loves Gregorius. RT @jonmorosi: Also possible #Indians would keep Cabrera and trade Gregorius.


Another mention

@SteveGilbertMLB: Possible that if the rumored Indians Reds deal goes down the #Dbacks could end up with Gregorius and not Cabrera.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:46 pm

@jonmorosi: #Reds would obtain another position player if the Choo trade happens, confirming @DKnobler report.


Phelps? Carrera? Pick on of 11 first basemen on the roster? Someone of significance?
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:49 pm

Wow, and the Tribe could hold ACab or flip him somewhere else. OR this could be a bigger deal ie ACab and Gregorius for Skaggs and Bauer.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:51 pm

Has to be someone on the Tribe's 40 man roster to make the deal work. Reportedly a position player going to Reds but who?


Juan Diaz, Ez Carrera, Russ Canzler, Chris McGuiness, Lars Anderson, Mike McDade, Thomas Neal, Jason Donald, Cord Phelps, Tim Fedroff, Lou Marson, Jan Gomes?
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby timdav » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:16 pm

You guys calling for the rumored players Cleveland acquires being part of another trade makes sense. In fact, with Cleveland's rebuilding status...a further trade is the only thing that makes sense....and one that involves acquiring starting pitching.

"Breaking news": just checked Twitter at 5:18pm EST and Paul Hoynes said it's an Arizona/Cleveland/Cincinnati are talking a 3-way trade, and that A-Cab is apparently NOT part of the discussion (at least so far). Hmmmmmmmm.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:20 pm

FWIW....this sounds like pure speculation oh his part but ultimately could be what happens in a sense.

@hoynsie: 3 team dealing cooking among #Indians, Reds, Arizona. Shin-Soo Choo headed to Cincy. Asdrubal Cabrera not involved as of right now.


EDIT: Sorry timdav, hadn't seem your post from The Hoynse
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:25 pm

I hate rumors.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:27 pm

BrianM wrote:I hate rumors.


You kidding...we're baseball fans....rumors are all we have!!! :biggrin
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:28 pm

BrianM wrote:I hate rumors.
Rumors are the best part of the Hot Stove.. except when it involves your team. Then they SUCK !...
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby A.Zajac » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:35 pm

Stubbs and Reynolds in the same lineup... No thanks. Trading Reds SS to AZ makes sense.. can see if we can get pitching back for that and I applaud that. Still have Cabrera though. If you aren't going to flip the Reds SS.. the heck are you stockpiling all these SS for? Could this also signal Nick Swisher may sign? Lots and lots of questions..
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:39 pm

During the winter meetings I feel like the rumors had substance because these writers and reporters are in the same buildings for over 72 hours with every GM in baseball. Now I just wonder how someone like Paul Hoynes could have this type of insider info. I'm sure he has a source inside somewhere, but did he just get a text from someone saying this is what is happening, or is he just referencing something that was talked about a couple of days ago and decided to throw it out there because he wanted a few hits. The Indians have proven to be tight lipped about this kind of stuff. I'm gonna focus on not forming an opinion till this stuff actually happens.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:46 pm

Per mlbtraderumors.com Drew Stubbs is expected to make $2.9 M in arb this offseason with 3 yrs of team control. While Choo is expected to make $7.9 M in arb and is a FA at the seasons end. Trade would potentially save the Tribe $5 M this season and add another talented strikeout prone RH bat to the lineup.

Worth watching...Tribe could hold ACab and flip him at a later point or this could be part of a bigger deal.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby A.Zajac » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:48 pm

Jerry Crasnick ‏@jcrasnick
But Gregorius has a .323 OBP in minors, doesn't steal bases and has 20 HRs in 1,755 professional ABs. #reds #indians

Jerry Crasnick ‏@jcrasnick
Pluses for Gregorius: He runs well and has a good glove & strong throwing arm. Also plays with energy. #reds

Jerry Crasnick ‏@jcrasnick
I checked with a couple of scouts who see Didi Gregorius as a utility player or average SS on 2nd division club. #reds


EDIT:
Will Carroll ‏@injuryexpert
Like Choo deal for Reds, but no idea why this would make sense for Indians unless Keith Woolner's secret formula loves Gregorius.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:53 pm

If a deal gets done that sends didi to AZ, then at least we can move on from the AZ talks. Boston, Seattle, and St Louis are all still quality trade partners that should be interested in ACab. Hopefully these teams backed down because they knew they didnt have the ammo the dbacks had. Not that theyre out, a bidding war could possibly ensue.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby timdav » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:53 pm

Even if Cleveland got ONE of the two rumored young starting pitchers from Az in 3-way trade for Choo, I'd be happy. Happiest if was Skaggs. Hey, we can dream, right?

And, use A-Cab in another trade for pitching...right?

Rumors bad? HUH??? Baseball rumors are incredible fun!
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:56 pm

BrianM wrote:During the winter meetings I feel like the rumors had substance because these writers and reporters are in the same buildings for over 72 hours with every GM in baseball. Now I just wonder how someone like Paul Hoynes could have this type of insider info. I'm sure he has a source inside somewhere, but did he just get a text from someone saying this is what is happening, or is he just referencing something that was talked about a couple of days ago and decided to throw it out there because he wanted a few hits. The Indians have proven to be tight lipped about this kind of stuff. I'm gonna focus on not forming an opinion till this stuff actually happens.


Well for what it's worth, Tony has people who talk to him too. If Tony's job was as the beat reporter for the Indians he would be offering up this info if it was presented to him somehow.

Also worth noting all of the national writers are latching onto Hoynes tweet. Would be easy for them to simply ignore it but if it has legs then they're at least giving him the credit of first report.

That said, I'll believe a multi team deal when I see it considering all the rumors recently, but it seems things could line up that way.
Last edited by GoTribe028 on Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:56 pm

A.Zajac wrote:Stubbs and Reynolds in the same lineup... No thanks. Trading Reds SS to AZ makes sense.. can see if we can get pitching back for that and I applaud that. Still have Cabrera though. If you aren't going to flip the Reds SS.. the heck are you stockpiling all these SS for? Could this also signal Nick Swisher may sign? Lots and lots of questions..


An OF of Brantley in LF, Stubbs in CF, and Swisher in RF could turn out to be pretty solid. Defensively it'd sure be nice. Not a huge fan of both Stubbs and Reynolds though either.


While we're speculating on 3-team deals and flipping guys....what about flipping Stubbs to the Rays for a pitcher? Stubbs wouldn't be a bad replacement for Upton in CF (similar player, good defense, power, speed...lots of K's). Jennings can stay in LF with Joyce in RF. Myers isn't going to start the year in TB and they may keep him down til June (avoid Super Two). Still would have the DH spot to slide Joyce to eventually then. Even after moving Shields still have some extra pitching. Stubbs probably would be more enticing to the Rays since he has 3 years left. Just a thought though. Tribe very well could keep Stubbs we would be very thin on OFers ourselves.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby GoTribe028 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:59 pm

@Ken_Rosenthal: Source: #Yankees sign Youkilis, one year, $12M.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby A.Zajac » Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:01 pm

GoTribe028 wrote:
@Ken_Rosenthal: Source: #Yankees sign Youkilis, one year, $12M.


6 million dollar difference between Reynolds and Youk.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby BrianM » Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:04 pm

GoTribe028 wrote:
BrianM wrote:During the winter meetings I feel like the rumors had substance because these writers and reporters are in the same buildings for over 72 hours with every GM in baseball. Now I just wonder how someone like Paul Hoynes could have this type of insider info. I'm sure he has a source inside somewhere, but did he just get a text from someone saying this is what is happening, or is he just referencing something that was talked about a couple of days ago and decided to throw it out there because he wanted a few hits. The Indians have proven to be tight lipped about this kind of stuff. I'm gonna focus on not forming an opinion till this stuff actually happens.


Well for what it's worth, Tony has people who talk to him too. If Tony's job was as the beat reporter for the Indians he would be offering up this info if it was presented to him somehow.

Also worth noting all of the national writers are latching onto Hoynes tweet. Would be easy for them to simply ignore it but if it has legs then they're at least giving him the credit of first report.

That said, I'll believe a multi team deal when I see it considering all the rumors recently, but it seems things could line up that way.


Ok. This seems like a valid response. I don't really like Hoynes personally, but ill put some trust in him.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:05 pm

The Dbax and Tribe had reportedly agreed to a trade structure around ACab and Bauer a week ago. The a tribe was insistent upon adding Skaggs and another prospect to the mix I could see the Tribe net 1 of about 3 pitchers Bauer, Skaggs or Bradley but doubt the Dbax will inc. Bradley or that the Tribe would want him bc he's at least 2/3 yrs from breaking into the bigs.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Edible14 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:21 pm

I think what makes sense for Arizona, if they're going to get ACab in a deal, is to also get a SS of the future. The Indians just so happen to have a bunch of those, so I wouldn't mind seeing them also get someone like Paulino in this trade if the return is big enough. So something like this makes sense to me:

D-Backs get: Cabrera, Paulino
Reds get: Choo, Cord Phelps
Indians Get: Skaggs, Bauer, Stubbs (not horrible as a 3rd OF, who can be replaced mid-season if need be), Gregorious (between him and Aviles, would be a good platoon for the short-term)

That's probably a little slanted towards the Reds, so I would probably want them to kick something towards the D-Backs here.
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Re: MLB Hot Stove

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:38 pm

Edible14 wrote:I think what makes sense for Arizona, if they're going to get ACab in a deal, is to also get a SS of the future. The Indians just so happen to have a bunch of those, so I wouldn't mind seeing them also get someone like Paulino in this trade if the return is big enough. So something like this makes sense to me:

D-Backs get: Cabrera, Paulino
Reds get: Choo, Cord Phelps
Indians Get: Skaggs, Bauer, Stubbs (not horrible as a 3rd OF, who can be replaced mid-season if need be), Gregorious (between him and Aviles, would be a good platoon for the short-term)

That's probably a little slanted towards the Reds, so I would probably want them to kick something towards the D-Backs here.


I don't think it's that slanted to the Reds personally, though wonder if it wouldn't be a reliever from Cleveland going. They resigned Bronxton and sounds like he could close. Last year they got him for a setup role, maybe a guy like Smith to replace him there? Think the Tribe is giving up a tad much already though even with getting both Bauer and Skaggs. Really don't want to give up Paulino unless we're getting something a bit more known. Skaggs and Bauer still are specs with lots to prove. Wouldn't be the worst deal though and interesting take on it. Think your logic on the D'backs wanting a more long-term option at SS or a future SS prospect makes sense.
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