2012 Draft Prospects

[homerawayfromhome]

Unless McClure is demanding the moon the Tribe is sitting pretty, with $703.5 K excess with the potential to overspend an additional $224 K without incurring a penalty.

Right now I don't believe it's actually an issue whether the Tribe gets Hamrick and McClure signed, it's actually what are the real terms when all is said and done.
Let's say for example the Tribe goes $500 K on McClure that's only $185 K over slot, and then gets Hamrick at $225 K which is about $90 K over slot and would leave the Tribe $425 K to spend without including the potential to add an additional $225 excess without invoking a penalty.
In other words the Tribe could sign McClure for $500 K, Hamrick for $225 K and then spend the additional $425 K on pks 11-40. They could potentially offer a player like Justin Garza $350 K (250 over) Logan Vick $175 K, (75 over) Nelson Rodriguez $150 K (50 over) and Cameron Cox $150 K (50 over).
I know that would be a tremendous haul by the Tribe and there is potential the Tribe is not able to utilize the resources as I suggested because signing a player like McClure or Garza could be more costly, but the point being is the Tribe can be aggressive and come away with a surprising amount of talent on / by the signing deadline.

[OhioBaseball]

I'm not going to argue b/c I've got other things to do.

All I'll say is if the Indians took Naquin (a consensus inferior prospect to Wacha, Stratton, Stroman) to save money so they can sign Caleb Hamrick or some other mediocre HS prospect not even ranked in the top 400 prospects by BA or PG then the Indians screwed up the draft. I really doubt it comes to that but I've yet to see this saved money spent. It could be on McClure, or maybe Garza but he's not all that awesome. It's possible the Indians bet on there being a Dillon Howard-type talent available in the 2nd round this year, but those types were all gone. Mitch Brown is good and he fell, but he's a notch below the talent Smoral, McCullers, Gallo, etc. are (there are guys that were speculated to potentially fall in the draft). I'm sure they had contingency plans in place, but its possible they tried to get too cute with the Naquin selection and counted their chickens before they hatched (the Indians would never admit this if true). I hope the Indians are able to come out of the draft with McClure and and maybe someone else. We'll see.

I'm rooting for the Indians to do well too, but I can't help but be objective.

[daingean]

I'm not going to argue b/c I've got other things to do.

All I'll say is if the Indians took Naquin (a consensus inferior prospect to Wacha, Stratton, Stroman) to save money so they can sign Caleb Hamrick or some other mediocre HS prospect not even ranked in the top 400 prospects by BA or PG then the Indians screwed up the draft. I really doubt it comes to that but I've yet to see this saved money spent. It could be on McClure, or maybe Garza but he's not all that awesome. It's possible the Indians bet on there being a Dillon Howard-type talent available in the 2nd round this year, but those types were all gone. Mitch Brown is good and he fell, but he's a notch below the talent Smoral, McCullers, Gallo, etc. are (there are guys that were speculated to potentially fall in the draft). I'm sure they had contingency plans in place, but its possible they tried to get too cute with the Naquin selection and counted their chickens before they hatched (the Indians would never admit this if true). I hope the Indians are able to come out of the draft with McClure and and maybe someone else. We'll see.

I'm rooting for the Indians to do well too, but I can't help but be objective.

I agree here. I'd rather have 1 "A" talent in the nest than 10 "B" talents. "A" talents have a much much greater chance of being impact players at the ML level (in truth if they would have had to overpay for the #1 guy, they'd have still gotten 5 of the "B" talents from the draft). Occasionally you do get a "B" talent that turns into something special at the ML level like a Brian Giles or a Jason Kipnis but that is a lot less frequent. I hope the Indians feel that Naquin is an "A" talent but lack of power makes me suspect. I am certainly excited about the guys we've drafted and rooting for them but would have preferred a power bat/arm in #1. My philosophy is drafting the BPA (based on tools/projection) is the best way to build the best Big League team and the skimping on the #1 to sign the other 9 (of the first 10 round picks) is the best way to build a good Minor League organization.

Edit: personally I think PG is a decent scouting organization but unless someone pays $500 to attend their showcase, their ratings are based on a handful of games (well even a showcase is not really all that accurate either as it is based on a pretend game). So you have to trust the scouting dept.

[JP_Frost]

I'm not going to argue b/c I've got other things to do.

All I'll say is if the Indians took Naquin (a consensus inferior prospect to Wacha, Stratton, Stroman) to save money so they can sign Caleb Hamrick or some other mediocre HS prospect not even ranked in the top 400 prospects by BA or PG then the Indians screwed up the draft. I really doubt it comes to that but I've yet to see this saved money spent. It could be on McClure, or maybe Garza but he's not all that awesome. It's possible the Indians bet on there being a Dillon Howard-type talent available in the 2nd round this year, but those types were all gone. Mitch Brown is good and he fell, but he's a notch below the talent Smoral, McCullers, Gallo, etc. are (there are guys that were speculated to potentially fall in the draft). I'm sure they had contingency plans in place, but its possible they tried to get too cute with the Naquin selection and counted their chickens before they hatched (the Indians would never admit this if true). I hope the Indians are able to come out of the draft with McClure and and maybe someone else. We'll see.

I'm rooting for the Indians to do well too, but I can't help but be objective.

Well, I am going to argue.

That first sentence is just untrue. The Indians picked Naquin, so they could sign some mediocre HS prospect? They picked Naquin because they felt the other guys weren't worth the higher price tag they would probably command, and it gave them more flexibility to pick higher upside talent in the later rounds. Possibly guys like McCullers.

You've got to have that money available if you want to make a splash in the later rounds, and the Tribe felt they could get the extra dough by going underslot in the first round. Besides, they probably thought Naquin was undervalued and saw something in him that some other teams/draft sites didn't. If they're right about that, we'll have to wait and see, but like I said earlier, outside of Giolito, I don't see anyone that would be worth the extra $500K (maybe Stroman).

I also don't understand why picking Naquin means the Indians could sign mediocre HS prospects. It also enables them to pick Mitch Brown, McClure, Schubert, Garza, so why focus on the guy you don't like? Doesn't seem that objective to me.

Seems like some of you are still looking at the draft with the old rules in mind. I agree that the new system takes some getting used to, but I think the Indians played it very well. Perhaps it's not the team you should be angry with, but the new CBA, because I think you better get used to these type of drafts.

[GeronimoSon]

First off.. great work on putting together the bonus pool summation. The information illustrates where the Indians are with respect to the oncoming signing deadline, now, just 17 days away.

The wise man would think that the Indians would have had a discussion or two with the adviser to D'Vone McClure or directly with D'Vone McClure regarding his decision to go pro or to attend the University of Arkansas.. The amount of money he can sign for has a limit that's been outlined.. The real question becomes.. Is professional baseball his dream?. If it is, then he'll sign.. if it's something that he 'just' wants to do..then he may SOOOOOOOOOEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEYYY !! Pig for a year or three is in his future..

Regarding the selection of Tyler Naquin to a below slot signing bonus (to form an excess pool of funds for later signings), well, if it walks like a duck & quacks like a duck, you'd have to think it is a duck...all evidence to the contrary... Teams that have done exceptionally well in the MLB draft have always taken the BPA. Unfortunately, talent will not be the only factor in getting to the ML's.. but it's a damn good place to start... With the new CBA, the Indians FO appear to have 'freaked out' a little and find themselves in the enviable position of having an excess allowance pool of funds and no one to sign to a big contract save for a couple of guys (Hambrick/Garza) and Mr. McClure..

btw.. this "pool" that has been described is money not spent..not excess money "sitting around" with no place to go.. you can almost begin to hear the "cheap, cheap, cheap" hecklers beginning to wind up their song about the Indians ownership...

[GeronimoSon]

...I also don't understand why picking Naquin means the Indians could sign mediocre HS prospects. It also enables them to pick Mitch Brown, McClure, Schubert, Garza, so why focus on the guy you don't like? Doesn't seem that objective to me.....

JP.. not to pick at nits (and now I'll go onto a nit picking diatribe...).. I don't believe Tyler Naquin is a guy posters on this board dislike. He represents the 'safe' or the 'solid' first round pick, not necessarily the BPA at the time of the pick. He could become one of the best draft picks the Indians have had since Jason Kipnis was selected.. He's got the maturity and the skill sets to be exactly that kind of impact player, perhaps a Toby Harrah / Lenny Dykstra type. Hopefully, a better version of who he's been comp'd to: Michael Brantley..

He just wasn't:
-Lucas Giolito: F.O.R. Ace of the Staff, best arm on the board, bar none.. when the Indians picked..
-Michael Wacha: F.O.R./M.O.R. arm with huge upside
-Richie Shaffer: 1B/3B; Power Hitter with amazing bat speed...
-Victor Roache: OF; Power hitting OF'er with unlimited upside (coming off injury)
-Stephen Piscotty, Joey Gallo, Lewis Brinson, or Lance McCullers. etc..

Tyler Naquin was projected to go in the second half of the draft's first round or on into the supplemental round. He was described as a perfect (read: safe) Atlanta Braves pick at the John Sickels site: Polished college player with limited upsided but average starter potential. Most of the scouting reports had the same thing to say.. nice player..will always hit.. strong arm.. not enough pop to stay at a corner position.. not enough speed/range to play up the middle.. At the end of the day, he's going to have to be good enough..

[daingean]

Tyler Naquin was projected to go in the second half of the draft's first round or on into the supplemental round. He was described as a perfect (read: safe) Atlanta Braves pick at the John Sickels site: Polished college player with limited upsided but average starter potential. Most of the scouting reports had the same thing to say.. nice player..will always hit.. strong arm.. not enough pop to stay at a corner position.. not enough speed/range to play up the middle.. At the end of the day, he's going to have to be good enough..

I think the FO thought Naquin was the BPA. My dislike is the criteria for selecting the BPA. This resembles the pre-Grant BPA evaluation process "BPA now but with limited projection". IMO, draft picks likes Sowers, Huff, Crowe, Gutherie as well as Mills & Aubrey fit this category (maybe White to a lesser extent). What has all of this given us? 4 of those 6 made it to the Show but none of them were/are impact players. Heck Huff is not even getting a sniff on the 5th starter Columbus->Cleveland carousel and this team needs a LHSP. I like the picks of Chiz, Pom and Lindor with both Chiz and Lindor being +projection picks but the jury is still out on them.

[JP_Frost]

It's not like Naquin was considered a third round draft choice. He was projected to go in the high teens all the way to the end of the first round.

I get the BPA comments and I'm normally one to support that strategy, unless there isn't a BPA. And in the eyes of the Indians, there clearly wasn't.

Giolito: Yes. Best talent in the entire draft perhaps, but major injury and signability concerns.
Wacha: Doesn't have huge upside. One of the best college arms out there, but #2 starter at best if all goes well.
Shaffer: Best college bat, who'd likely move to 1st base. Not a pure hitter, but good power potential.
Roache: Tremendous power, but serious wrist injury and couldn't show any development in terms of approach at the plate.
Piscotty certainly isn't ahead of Naquin. Gallo we can dream on potential, but he's a HS 1B basically with light tower power and Adam Dunn K tendency, McCullers was viewed by quite a few people as a bullpen arm, Brinson is all raw projection, like McClure.

I'm not going to lie and say I wanted Naquin at #15 or that I had him on my radar. But I can see the reason why the Indians picked him and it's not just financial. They feel really strongly about him playing CF. Consensus is that he's plus hitter (some even said plus plus) with a plus plus arm. Good baserunner, with solid speed, very little power. That package in CF is a very valuable player and much more than an average starter. Obviously it all hinges on him playing the position well, but he was basically the only guy with the upside to play a premium position out of that group. That's probably what made him so enticing for the Indians.

Look, if some of you would rather have Stratton or Wacha right now and more college seniors drafted in rounds 2-10 to free up cash, that's all good. I just happen to agree with what the Indians chose as their strategy and like the guys they picked in this draft (including Naquin).

[OhioBaseball]

I'm not going to argue b/c I've got other things to do.

All I'll say is if the Indians took Naquin (a consensus inferior prospect to Wacha, Stratton, Stroman) to save money so they can sign Caleb Hamrick or some other mediocre HS prospect not even ranked in the top 400 prospects by BA or PG then the Indians screwed up the draft. I really doubt it comes to that but I've yet to see this saved money spent. It could be on McClure, or maybe Garza but he's not all that awesome. It's possible the Indians bet on there being a Dillon Howard-type talent available in the 2nd round this year, but those types were all gone. Mitch Brown is good and he fell, but he's a notch below the talent Smoral, McCullers, Gallo, etc. are (there are guys that were speculated to potentially fall in the draft). I'm sure they had contingency plans in place, but its possible they tried to get too cute with the Naquin selection and counted their chickens before they hatched (the Indians would never admit this if true). I hope the Indians are able to come out of the draft with McClure and and maybe someone else. We'll see.

I'm rooting for the Indians to do well too, but I can't help but be objective.

Well, I am going to argue.

That first sentence is just untrue. The Indians picked Naquin, so they could sign some mediocre HS prospect? They picked Naquin because they felt the other guys weren't worth the higher price tag they would probably command, and it gave them more flexibility to pick higher upside talent in the later rounds. Possibly guys like McCullers.

You've got to have that money available if you want to make a splash in the later rounds, and the Tribe felt they could get the extra dough by going underslot in the first round. Besides, they probably thought Naquin was undervalued and saw something in him that some other teams/draft sites didn't. If they're right about that, we'll have to wait and see, but like I said earlier, outside of Giolito, I don't see anyone that would be worth the extra $500K (maybe Stroman).

I also don't understand why picking Naquin means the Indians could sign mediocre HS prospects. It also enables them to pick Mitch Brown, McClure, Schubert, Garza, so why focus on the guy you don't like? Doesn't seem that objective to me.

Seems like some of you are still looking at the draft with the old rules in mind. I agree that the new system takes some getting used to, but I think the Indians played it very well. Perhaps it's not the team you should be angry with, but the new CBA, because I think you better get used to these type of drafts.

JP. Go back and read what I actually said. I sprinkled in an "if" or two in my comments, which you may have missed.

As you say, it is possible the Indians didn't think Wacha, Stratton or Stroman were worth the money they were asking, or it may not be. None of us actually know, and we never will know. All we know is public data, which, on a consensus basis, had those guys all ranked ahead of Naquin. I never saw Stratton, but I've seen Wacha, Stroman and Naquin and I think Wacha is a better prospect, in my opinion. I've seen a lot of college prospects over the last decade and I feel confident in that.

Lets not forget the Indians punted their 6th, 9th and 10th round picks, which saved $410.5k in extra money (based on Homer's projections), on top of $500k saved from Naquin.

Brown was $160k overslot, Schubert was $105k overslot. When including the $500k the Indians saved on the Naquin selection, they've got a lot of money left to be spent which is my concern at this juncture.

We'll see what McClure demands, but my entire point is the Indians could have taken Stratton, Stoman or Wacha and still have been able to sign guys like Brown, Baker, and Schubert with money saved from their 6th, 9th and 10th round picks. They didn't need to take Naquin but if they really think he's better, then I question their judgment. Their draft track record isn't exemplary enough to get a free pass.

BTW, as Geronimo suggested, I'm not suggesting the Indians are going cheap. I'm suggesting the POSSIBILITY the Indians made the Naquin selection betting that there'd be a Smoral or McCullers available in the 2nd round and it turns out there wasn't.

[JP_Frost]

The last part of your post, is my entire point. They saved money in order to take one or two of those high upside guys. The big names we mentioned weren't there anymore, so they used those savings on several other high upside prep players.

[homerawayfromhome]

I agree the Tribe felt a guy like McCullers might slide through. Matt Smoral signed for $2 M with the Jays, the Tribe may have gotten him at 15 and still signed him for that or even the $1.75 M Naquin signed for. Personally I wasn't a fan of Stratton but I would have liked Shaffer, Piscotty or Wacha rather than Naquin although I felt all ranked very closely together. I don't feel like it was about signability as much as it was the combo with organizational priorities. The Tribe simply, emphasizes up the middle players and solid defense. Naquin meets those criteria as well as offers the potential to be a very sound CF, which I believe can and will be.
The truth is the Tribe may have been overly cute, it's hard to say...but it could be more that they felt they would be aggressive on guys like Garza, Cox, Rodriguez, Hawkins and others who offer very good upside and are potentially difficult to get signed. It's nothing new for the Tribe to take late rd fliers, but the question is we're they overly cute trying to save money to spend money. It could be while well intentioned they actually left talent on the board they may have otherwise selected. This whole process, has complicated things.
Personally, I think the overall "success" of this draft (in terms of talent added) hinges upon getting D'Vone McClure signed. McClure compares favorably IMO to others like Brinson. However, I prefer McClure who offers athletic ability and tremendous upside. McClure is a guy that could surpass Naquin in the OF in 4 / 5 yrs and add a dynamic element to the system. Overall, I don't think McClure will come cheap but will get signed.

[Tondo]

This shouldn't be very hard to understand....if we took a "slot" guy like Wacha or Shaffer at 15 we probably draft a "Wendle" or "Jacob Lee" in round 4/5 and not McClure and we probably don't "risk" Mitch Brown in the 2nd either, we probably could not even afford going over slot on Schubert and Hamrick either rather going with a Vick/Lucas in rounds 6-10

It's all about quality and quantity of said quality and since we're talking specs that are 3-4 years away from the big show I'd rather have 4-6 lottery tickets in Naquin, M.Brown, McClure and Schubert/Hamrick and maybe 1 of Garza/Calica/Cox than only 1 and done in "overslot" Giolito or 2 with "slot" Wacha and another mid rounder we could have afforded (maybe a Schubert/Hamrick)

When your total budget is barely over 4.5mil, saving 500k is HUGE and as JP has been pointing out...it's not like there were other specs left that are "worth" 500k more than Naquin

To put it in math terms:

Naquin + M.Brown + McClure + Schubert/Hamrick > Giolito + 3/4 Wendle's/Lee's
Naquin + M.Brown + McCLure > Wacha or Shaffer + 2 Wendle/Lee's

That said, we absolutely need McClure to sign and I want Vick too....if we get those 2, everything on top is just icing on the cake for me, though 2 of Hamrick, Rodriguez, Cox, Calica, Garza would be a real nice haul for our budget

[GoTribe028]

Happy to see the Indians seem close to signing (if not already) 15th rounder Nelson Rodriguez. Looks like a complete project but looks to have some serious power in that bat.

[homerawayfromhome]

It's good to see the Tribe snag a power bat like Rodriguez, I doubt he plays anywhere but 1b / DH. Curious what the cost was, but Rodriguez was deemed singable so maybe $100 k or little over was enough to get him inked.

[GeronimoSon]

..Naquin + M.Brown + McClure + Schubert/Hamrick > Giolito + 3/4 Wendle's/Lee's..

Disagree... Giolito reaching his considerable potential trumps the average to above average OF'er + BOR/MOR SP + the middling OF'er.. You can't underestimate the value of a front of the rotation starter.. even more so with the Indians lack of a true ace...

[JP_Frost]

Nor can you dismiss TINSTAAPP and the serious injury concern with Giolito. Of course he has amazing potential, but without those red flags he won't get out of the top 3, so the mere fact that he was there when we picked should tell you something.

[homerawayfromhome]

I expect Giolito to have to have TJ at some point. I speak from personal experience having had a serious UCL strain. These injuries just don't heal all that well. Once there is damage to that elbow it will always be weak unless there is intervention.

Washington was probably the right team to take a chance on Giolito, remember Strasburg had a similar injury (and TJ) and has since returned effectively. The Nationals have first hand experience. For all we know Giolito could blow his elbow out again and eventually find himself as nothing more than a bullpen arm. Theres no guarantee he ever becomes what he could and in truth, he already has a strike against him.

[GeronimoSon]

Bottom line.. he did get out of the top three and was the "low hanging fruit" of the first round that presented itself to the Indians when it was their turn to select in the Rule IV draft.. Even if he does need TJ surgery, it certainly wouldn't take away from him becoming the projected F.O.R. SP the Indians lack in the system. There is a red flag here.. it's the lack of risk appetite when a player of such considerable projected ability is passed on when the "fix" can be mitigated either by hard work or a surgical intervention followed by hard work.

This does not take away from the talents on display in Mahoning Valley as it's a pretty good certainty that young Mr Naquin is going to become a fine major league baseball player. He's just not going to be the next Justin Verlander.. or Clayton Kershaw or Steven Strasburg or David Price.. Does anyone really think Mitch Brown will?

[JP_Frost]

And Giolito will reach those levels?

TJ surgery is taken for granted nowadays. I've said this before. It's still a very serious surgery with possible negative effects on the rest of your career.

I can't blame a team for not taking that chance with an 18-year old HS'er who will cost you millions of dollars (we did the same with Aviles, but he came with a much lower price tag).

[GeronimoSon]

And Giolito will reach those levels?

TJ surgery is taken for granted nowadays. I've said this before. It's still a very serious surgery with possible negative effects on the rest of your career.

I can't blame a team for not taking that chance with an 18-year old HS'er who will cost you millions of dollars (we did the same with Aviles, but he came with a much lower price tag).

With the players on the board at the time the Indians selected.. he is one of the very few who have that level of projection.

[homerawayfromhome]

That's true Giolito does have FOR potential but also potential to wash out.

[OhioBaseball]

Arkansas baseball coach, Dave Van Horn, said that he believes McClure will sign with the Indians (according an end of season report from the team).

The one thing that stood out to me about McClure is that he looks great in his short clips, but I was a little surprised to see him ranked between 90 and 110 overall by the experts...seeming to suggest there are issues with him. Here's something I found (for free) on the internet...It sounds like McClure is raw with pretty bad plate discipline, but that's not surprising considering he was there in the fourth round. We'll have to be patient with him.

"McClure is an excellent athlete with one of the best bodies in the draft, but he's extremely raw across the board and is likely a long-term player development project for a team willing to wait five years to see a real return on its investment.

At the plate, he has bat speed and pretty good hand-eye coordination, but his recognition is poor and he swings and misses too often at the high school level. He lands with his front foot turned out and doesn't have great loft in his swing. He's in center now but likely ends up in a corner in pro ball. He's a great upside player in the third-round range, but very high-risk as well."

Could be a good idea for McClure to go pro. Given how raw he is and that he's signed to play in the SEC, he may not get much playing time b/c coaches won't be all that patient with players considering that its the most competitive conference in college baseball.

[BrianM]

^ Good info. Thanks for the effort.

[Rocky55]

Arkansas baseball coach, Dave Van Horn, said that he believes McClure will sign with the Indians (according an end of season report from the team).

The one thing that stood out to me about McClure is that he looks great in his short clips, but I was a little surprised to see him ranked between 90 and 110 overall by the experts...seeming to suggest there are issues with him. Here's something I found (for free) on the internet...It sounds like McClure is raw with pretty bad plate discipline, but that's not surprising considering he was there in the fourth round. We'll have to be patient with him.

"McClure is an excellent athlete with one of the best bodies in the draft, but he's extremely raw across the board and is likely a long-term player development project for a team willing to wait five years to see a real return on its investment.

At the plate, he has bat speed and pretty good hand-eye coordination, but his recognition is poor and he swings and misses too often at the high school level. He lands with his front foot turned out and doesn't have great loft in his swing. He's in center now but likely ends up in a corner in pro ball. He's a great upside player in the third-round range, but very high-risk as well."

Could be a good idea for McClure to go pro. Given how raw he is and that he's signed to play in the SEC, he may not get much playing time b/c coaches won't be all that patient with players considering that its the most competitive conference in college baseball.

I read the same thing but don't remember where. Gives you pause, doesn't it?

I don't mean that we shouldn't try to sign McClure but maybe don't go overboard with the bonus offers. Then again, it's only one guy's opinion for what it's worth. Maybe the scouts like him better.

A Stupid New CBA question: If we don't sign McClure we lose his slot value for signing but can spend anything over that on post round ten guys, right?

Who of Joshua Pigg, Justin Garza, Cory Raley, Randall Fant, Colyn(The Project) O'Connell, or Anthony(Vogelbach) Hawkins should we target in lieu of McClure/Hamrick? I know some have mentioned Calica but he seems low upside to me. Ditto Logan Vick but I like Vick better than Calica, just because I think Calica's upside is what Vick is now.

Last thing, it was good to see the rumored signing of Nelson Rodriguez become official. How are we going to get him & Aguilar on the same team? They'll probably have to sit on opposite sides of the plane during flights. Why am I reminded of the commercial with the two sumo wrestlers sitting on the couch?

[Tondo]

If we don't sign McClure we lose his slot bonus of 315k relative to our bonus pool of 4.58mil and only could spend 4.265mil overall...it's like we'd have signed him for slot money, just without having him...if that makes sense (it doesn't, that's why we should look to sign him....would be a huge waste otherwise)

The "net loss" though would be 215k since we can offer 100k for outisde Top 10 rounders without hitting the bonus pool

That said...since we are 715k under the budget (pre-Rodriguez though, not sure how much over 100k he got), not signing McClure would still leave us at 715k under the "new" budget and that plus Hamrick's 136k slot value would be the maximum we could offer Hamrick then (850k)...or we could spend up to 815k on 1 spec outside the top10

If we can get McClure and Hamrick to sign for 700-750k combined, we still would have 400k of budget to throw around (on top of 100k to ANY spec left)...maybe 150-200k for Vick? same for Fant? 200-250k for C.Cox? another 200-250k for Pigg? That'd be around 800k (400k of remaining budget + 4x100k without ponus pool hit)...that'd be a pretty nice haul, don't you think?
Or we could go "all in" on Garza with 400-500k and maybe sneak Vick in there too (not sure what the leverage is for College Juniors picked after round 5 for getting much more than 150k since even Top 10 rounds picked SRs don't get anywhere close to that)

[homerawayfromhome]

Thanks @ Ohiobaseball.

Van Horn also said the Tribe would sign Dillon Howard last yr. man he must hate the Tribe. :)
I believe we see McClure signed at about 750 k, Hamrick about 200 k. That would leave the Tribe about 200 k to spend. But I have yet to hear how much Nelson Rodriguez has pocketed. Although I'm sure bc it's remained unannounced it's above slot and potentially above Hamricks slot value. I'm not sure, just guessing but maybe 150-200 k on Rodriguez.
The Tribe could also spend about 200 k more without hitting the penalty for overslot signings.

[jellis]

Arkansas baseball coach, Dave Van Horn, said that he believes McClure will sign with the Indians (according an end of season report from the team).

The one thing that stood out to me about McClure is that he looks great in his short clips, but I was a little surprised to see him ranked between 90 and 110 overall by the experts...seeming to suggest there are issues with him. Here's something I found (for free) on the internet...It sounds like McClure is raw with pretty bad plate discipline, but that's not surprising considering he was there in the fourth round. We'll have to be patient with him.

"McClure is an excellent athlete with one of the best bodies in the draft, but he's extremely raw across the board and is likely a long-term player development project for a team willing to wait five years to see a real return on its investment.

At the plate, he has bat speed and pretty good hand-eye coordination, but his recognition is poor and he swings and misses too often at the high school level. He lands with his front foot turned out and doesn't have great loft in his swing. He's in center now but likely ends up in a corner in pro ball. He's a great upside player in the third-round range, but very high-risk as well."

Could be a good idea for McClure to go pro. Given how raw he is and that he's signed to play in the SEC, he may not get much playing time b/c coaches won't be all that patient with players considering that its the most competitive conference in college baseball.

Based on what I read and saw, he would be the last guy from the class to make the majors. The reason he was in the 4th round was he was a hard sign, who is 5 to 6 years away from the majors. While he is a great athlete he really has average speed, which means he is prolly not a centerfielder long term which also hurt. He is a right handed bat with plus power and great bat speed but that is really it in terms of plus tools. I hope he gets signed, but he is not an elite type of spec

[OhioBaseball]

Last thing, it was good to see the rumored signing of Nelson Rodriguez become official. How are we going to get him & Aguilar on the same team? They'll probably have to sit on opposite sides of the plane during flights. Why am I reminded of the commercial with the two sumo wrestlers sitting on the couch?

Yeah, Rodriguez looks to be in really bad shape in the scouting bureau tapes, but in Perfect Game he's not quite as bad. Regardless, the guy looks like he's got a legit bat. This guy looks like a hitter. I don't know what the signing bonus is, but he looks like a good addition to the system whether he's going to be out of shape and strictly a dh/1b type or not.

[JP_Frost]

Well, looks like both McClure and Hamrick will get signed. Sweet!

Really excited about McClure.

EDIT: Aaccording to Jim Callis, McClure signed for 765K, which is about 450K above slot.

[Tondo]

McCLure got high 2nd round money, but we knew it has to be well over slot to get him in...

Nice job overall.....they had 2 Top 100 picks and managed to sign 4 Top 100 guys (per BA)

I hope we get Vick in there too...in theory he should not be able to demand more than 200k since he will have a hard time to demand as much as a SR...no matter where he's going next draft

With the 100k head start on picks outside the Top 10 rounds there could be still room to sign 2 guys....was hoping for Vick and Fant but sounds like it's not likely...if Vick signs for 200k, they could still throw 220k at someone...1 of Cameron Cox, Fant, Calica, O'Connell or Pigg could be within reach

[toledobuck]

Any chance McClure or Hamrick get any playing time in the AZL this year?

[petes999]

Can I ask a stupid question of how the new rules hurts the Indians? A lot of talk was that the new rules hurt the flexibility. I said that the Indians never really pushed that hard even when they spent a whole lot of money as other teams like the pirates outspent us by ridiculous some money. Thus, I was less worried about putting a cap on spending that the Indians seldom reached.

With signing at least six high school players in the top 15 and acouple cc players which seemed agrees solve to me, did the cap on spending actually help the Indians by lowering their demands other than McClure? With the addition of the lottery picks for small teams next year, should we be helped even more?

[JP_Frost]

I think it helps and it hurts.

Don't forget that you have to draft some college seniors in the top 10 as well to make room in your draft pool for the higher upside picks. Those seniors will be organizational filler and those picks could've been used on legit prospects.

I am a little surprised to see a lot of slot or below slot signings, even for some high profile draftees. All in all I think the Indians played the system well and hopefully we can get an extra pick next year through the lottery.

Btw, the Indians can still spend up to almost $550K total on a player today without losing a pick (though they'd have to pay tax).

[MadThinker88]

JP- thanks for the detail about how much can be spent with tax penalty but no pick penalty.
Doubt the Tribe will go beyond the 220k they have left, but it will be good to watch.

[homerawayfromhome]

I'd throw 500 k at Garza, if he'd bite otherwise I'd get Logan Vick signed and Randall Fant.

[JP_Frost]

Appel didn't sign with the Pirates. Giolito signed with the Nats for a little less than $3M.

[OhioBaseball]

Mark Appel goes unsigned. Pretty big deal. He'll be back in the draft next year. I think he's overrated, but it'll help the depth of the class next year. Get ready for the Stanek vs. Appel questions.

Lucas Giolito signed for $2.925MM at the last minute. Great work by the Nationals.

[OhioBaseball]

Indians signed Logan Vick.

[OhioBaseball]

$125k for Vick (Twitter)

[JP_Frost]

$125k for Vick (Twitter)

So $25K overslot or $125K overslot?

Anyway, good news. Really like what the Tribe did this year. Seems like a very nice haul considering the new rules and lack of extra picks. The lowers minors have just become even more interesting to follow.

[Tondo]

Just 25k over slot, as could have been expected all along.....strange that they didn't throw the remaining pool at someone else...could have offered close to 300k at any other spec...maybe the high end guys declined that and others were't worth it? ot it goes into international pool?

[homerawayfromhome]

We haven't heard Rodriguez's bonus yet but I seriously doubt it eclipsed the 200k the Tribe had left over. I'm sure the Tribe did offer max money to several guys to get them to bite, but it didn't happen. Overall, glad to see the sheer volume of talent signed.

[JP_Frost]

The draft pool money you save is lost I believe.

Maybe the extra cash they had wasn't going to be enough for other targets. I also think the Indians didn't think any of them were worth paying the tax for.

[Tondo]

Just looking at the entire unsigned list from BA and this one caught my eye: Senior 1B/OF Preston Tucker, 7th round pick of the Astros didn't sign...that's very strange...is he now free to sign with any org? If so, he'd be a guy I'd be willing to give some or all of the remaining bonus pool

[JP_Frost]

Just looking at the entire unsigned list from BA and this one caught my eye: Senior 1B/OF Preston Tucker, 7th round pick of the Astros didn't sign...that's very strange...is he now free to sign with any org? If so, he'd be a guy I'd be willing to give some or all of the remaining bonus pool

I do believe that undrafted college seniors become free agents. Unless they changed that as well in the new CBA.

Tucker is definately interesting. Slot for that pick was about $150K.

[OhioBaseball]

Interesting catch on Tucker. Maybe he just doesn't want to play pro ball? For some of these guys that are good students with good degrees, it's probably a better decision just to start your professional career rather than toil around in the minor leagues for years with only a small chance of making the majors.

Interesting HS'er that didn't sign -- Alec Rash. The Phillies took him in the 2nd round, did not sign him and he'll be going to Missouri. Apparently he's had a bad summer, but Rash is a guy with *potential* to go very early in 2015, as in first couple of picks. Very high upside, risky arm. He's got some rough edges right now, but he'll have time to smooth them out and physically mature. Interesting college follow for the next few years!

[dazindiansfanuk]

Just looking at the entire unsigned list from BA and this one caught my eye: Senior 1B/OF Preston Tucker, 7th round pick of the Astros didn't sign...that's very strange...is he now free to sign with any org? If so, he'd be a guy I'd be willing to give some or all of the remaining bonus pool

I do believe that undrafted college seniors become free agents. Unless they changed that as well in the new CBA.

Tucker is definately interesting. Slot for that pick was about $150K.

Don't quote me but, I'm pretty sure the deadline doesn't apply to college seniors.... still think the 'stros have sole rights to him for the time being.

[JP_Frost]

You are right about that. This deadline doesn't apply to college seniors.

[homerawayfromhome]

I believe part of the reason Tucker has remained unsigned is due to the fact the Astros are in the first tier of the penalty phase, meaning they will be taxed for going over their bonus pool total. If Tucker lands more than the 150 k that amount will be taxable. As a college SR. Tucker would appear to have little leverage and overall, would be a nice add to the Astros system.

[Hermie13]

Mark Appel goes unsigned. Pretty big deal. He'll be back in the draft next year. I think he's overrated, but it'll help the depth of the class next year. Get ready for the Stanek vs. Appel questions.

Lucas Giolito signed for $2.925MM at the last minute. Great work by the Nationals.

Risky move by Appel IMO. Teams may play hardball with him next year as a college senior with little leverage. Then again, a team in the top 5 may take him hoping he'll be an easy slot sign and could make out ok. Could also be gambling that MLB tweaks the draft process as a lot of teams seemed displeased with the new arrangement. I'm guessing nothing will change next year but you never know; Selig has been making so many changes lately i wouldn't put anything past him. Personally don't hate the new system as much as many but do think it could use some alterations.


Agree, great job by the Nats to got Giolito signed. Reports are saying it came right down to the last minute. Very risky pick but it paid off for them (at least so far).