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Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

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Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Chiefroy » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:08 am

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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:30 am

Reports are saying a full no-trade clause plus an opt out on some date after Grady returns. Depending on money, could be an ok band-aid.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:42 am

I would assume it would be in with Damon and out with Cunningham (if he signs). This would mean that Donald would have to be the back-up CF (where he has 0 ML game experience). Likely it would also push Brantley down in the line-up and Damon at the top.

I don't like the no-trade clause but this team is desperate for offense.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby ClevelandBlues » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:19 am

daingean wrote:I would assume it would be in with Damon and out with Cunningham (if he signs). This would mean that Donald would have to be the back-up CF (where he has 0 ML game experience). Likely it would also push Brantley down in the line-up and Damon at the top.

I don't like the no-trade clause but this team is desperate for offense.


I am not sure it will be Cunningham out considering that would leave us with only Brantley to play center. I could see maybe Gomez being optioned to the minors for a start since there is an off day today and Monday. Damon has only played four games in center in the last three years, so I am not sure if that is an option. If and when we sign him, the question is should his playing time come at the expense of Duncan or Kotchman? Kotchman is better defensively, but Duncan brings more offense and is right handed, two things we could really use right now.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Prosecutor » Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:24 am

Trevor Crowe is finally healthy and raking in Columbus. I'd rather give him one more shot than a 38 yo retread.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:36 am

ClevelandBlues wrote:
daingean wrote:I would assume it would be in with Damon and out with Cunningham (if he signs). This would mean that Donald would have to be the back-up CF (where he has 0 ML game experience). Likely it would also push Brantley down in the line-up and Damon at the top.

I don't like the no-trade clause but this team is desperate for offense.


I am not sure it will be Cunningham out considering that would leave us with only Brantley to play center. I could see maybe Gomez being optioned to the minors for a start since there is an off day today and Monday. Damon has only played four games in center in the last three years, so I am not sure if that is an option. If and when we sign him, the question is should his playing time come at the expense of Duncan or Kotchman? Kotchman is better defensively, but Duncan brings more offense and is right handed, two things we could really use right now.



Signing Damon would include a roster move on the 40. Since they would eventually have to bring Gomez back up, I would suspect they would go with the Cunningham move (as he would probably make it through waivers at this point). Crowe is a possibility also but I see the FO waiting until May to make sure he's really back and ready.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby A.Zajac » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:23 am

daingean wrote:
ClevelandBlues wrote:
daingean wrote:I would assume it would be in with Damon and out with Cunningham (if he signs). This would mean that Donald would have to be the back-up CF (where he has 0 ML game experience). Likely it would also push Brantley down in the line-up and Damon at the top.

I don't like the no-trade clause but this team is desperate for offense.


I am not sure it will be Cunningham out considering that would leave us with only Brantley to play center. I could see maybe Gomez being optioned to the minors for a start since there is an off day today and Monday. Damon has only played four games in center in the last three years, so I am not sure if that is an option. If and when we sign him, the question is should his playing time come at the expense of Duncan or Kotchman? Kotchman is better defensively, but Duncan brings more offense and is right handed, two things we could really use right now.



Signing Damon would include a roster move on the 40. Since they would eventually have to bring Gomez back up, I would suspect they would go with the Cunningham move (as he would probably make it through waivers at this point). Crowe is a possibility also but I see the FO waiting until May to make sure he's really back and ready.


Crowe is already off the 40 man so he's not an option.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:40 am

A.Zajac wrote:
daingean wrote:
ClevelandBlues wrote:
daingean wrote:I would assume it would be in with Damon and out with Cunningham (if he signs). This would mean that Donald would have to be the back-up CF (where he has 0 ML game experience). Likely it would also push Brantley down in the line-up and Damon at the top.

I don't like the no-trade clause but this team is desperate for offense.


I am not sure it will be Cunningham out considering that would leave us with only Brantley to play center. I could see maybe Gomez being optioned to the minors for a start since there is an off day today and Monday. Damon has only played four games in center in the last three years, so I am not sure if that is an option. If and when we sign him, the question is should his playing time come at the expense of Duncan or Kotchman? Kotchman is better defensively, but Duncan brings more offense and is right handed, two things we could really use right now.



Signing Damon would include a roster move on the 40. Since they would eventually have to bring Gomez back up, I would suspect they would go with the Cunningham move (as he would probably make it through waivers at this point). Crowe is a possibility also but I see the FO waiting until May to make sure he's really back and ready.


Crowe is already off the 40 man so he's not an option.


I know...I guess I should have stated that in response to the Prosecutor's post....I don't see the Tribe calling him up unless they are reasonably sure he's a better option (as it would take a 40 move).
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:12 pm

daingean wrote:I would assume it would be in with Damon and out with Cunningham (if he signs). This would mean that Donald would have to be the back-up CF (where he has 0 ML game experience). Likely it would also push Brantley down in the line-up and Damon at the top.

I don't like the no-trade clause but this team is desperate for offense.


This was my first thought as well...though maybe Lopez loses out as Damon could DH at times when Hafner is sitting and Santana playing some more 1st (if they want to sit Kotchman). Lopez would be a little redundant then with Donald backing up the infield. Would rather see Cunningham go though even if it leaves us thin in CF.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby ironmike » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:36 pm

Acquiring Damon doesn't make sense versus trying to acquire a Torii Hunter type. If we can't get a young impact player then we should at least try to get a veteram player who can contribute to the defensive side of the diamond as well as one who brings tangibles.

Don't see Damon helping that much at the expense of sitting Hafner ditto when Sizemore returns. Not sure Sizemore helps us contend with the Tigers much less separate from the Royals, Twins and Royals.

How could we have such a "terrific" farm system if we can't develop our own position players???
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:39 pm

ironmike wrote:Acquiring Damon doesn't make sense versus trying to acquire a Torii Hunter type. If we can't get a young impact player then we should at least try to get a veteram player who can contribute to the defensive side of the diamond as well as one who brings tangibles.


Torrii Hunter has a no-trade clause, makes $15M, and is the starting RFer for a team trying to win the World Series.

Maybe they'd be willing to move him at the deadline when Trout is ready, but even then you gotta convince Hunter to waive his no-trade clause. Doubtful he'd want to leave LA (where he could finally win a WS title this year) and come to Cleveland.

Damon is a free agent who likely won't cost a lot of money (plus may opt out anyways).
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Edible14 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:33 pm

I'm okay with this move if it's at the expense of Cunningham. Cunningham showed nothing this spring, and frankly he ended up on the roster because nobody else was impressive either, and he already had a 40 man roster spot. Damon would be a good offensive option, and wouldn't be the worst option we've considered defensively out in left field.

To me, though, this is a panic move. I don't like panic moves, because baseball is a game that requires a good bit of patience. If the Indians FO thinks that Damon is good enough to drop what they have... why couldn't they have come to this conclusion before the end of spring training? To me, this screams of the Indians reacting way too much to the results of 5 games.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:04 pm

Edible14 wrote:I'm okay with this move if it's at the expense of Cunningham. Cunningham showed nothing this spring, and frankly he ended up on the roster because nobody else was impressive either, and he already had a 40 man roster spot. Damon would be a good offensive option, and wouldn't be the worst option we've considered defensively out in left field.

To me, though, this is a panic move. I don't like panic moves, because baseball is a game that requires a good bit of patience. If the Indians FO thinks that Damon is good enough to drop what they have... why couldn't they have come to this conclusion before the end of spring training? To me, this screams of the Indians reacting way too much to the results of 5 games.


It smells like a panic move but I'm not certain it really is because I think the following were all factors:

1. the Indians have wanted to upgrade LF for a while but wanted to see if anything changed with AC until the season started.

2. FO was sending feelers out and watching the waiver wire and then when nothing they liked came up available then they decided to go with plan C.

3. Certainly the lack of runs expedited the decision but this was a decision they've been looking at for a few weeks.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby criznit2009 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:13 pm

Damon as the lead-off hitter? Or?

Think once he's ready, if Brantley hasn't started producing more you have to pencil Damon is as your lead-off hitter I think.

About as good a move the tribe can make right now, it is a desperate move on paper, when you pull 38yr old FA back into the game 2 weeks into the season especially considering he didnt play ST anywhere it looks (is) desperate. With that said I am fine with it. Whether or not this deal works for the tribe comes down to one major thing. How well Damon can play the OF. If he plays decent he will prolly be a better option then Duncan most days, and if he hits he becomes the 1st guy off the bench in a multitude of rolls. Call it a coin flip and given the circumstances I will take it. Damon really has an opportunity to put up some numbers here, lets hope he can do it. Beating another dead horse, would someone remind me again what was so wrong will Willingham? I know some FO guy said he was a perfect fit offensively-but something, something... Any way.....I like it - Damon was good as a move was going to get and i will take it.


Crowe is not an option right now. Not on the 40 and really needs to prove him self this season. I see a possibility where Crowe could play himself back into consideration, if he can man CF and run the bases he could get one more shot. He has a lot of work to do, but you have to like his start so far.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby GhostofTedCox » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:20 pm

Q: Why did the Indians sign Johnny Damon?
A: Because Albert Belle wasn't available.

To say this is a panic move by the front office after a handful of games is an understatement.
Why couldn't they sign Damon during spring training? Has anything changed?

Damon doesn't fit at all. We need a regular LF or CF. Damon hardly plays any field anymore.

Rumors are that the contract will have a no-trade, and opt out after Sizemore returns. What the hell is that? He gets released when Sizemore is activated in July, so he can go to a contender, with no compensation. What happens 2 weeks after Sizemore is activated, and he gets hurt again?

The Indians are paying the price for the failure of the front office to find an acceptable LF in the off season. Actually Terry Pluto mentioned that the Indians have been looking for a LF for 7 years. Since Coco Crisp.

This is what we've sunk to a week after opening day.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby criznit2009 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:34 pm

Kind of surprising how the F.O's complete lack of addressing the OF (1B/LF) this off-season (they made a few dinky moves) has escalated so quickly. I'll take Damon, but he is no Willingham,Cuddyer, Beltran, Cepedes, Crisp (yikes!) - total failure by the powers in charge to get us a BAT. A RH'd one in particular that plays either OF or 1B. 100% complete total failure - no doubt. Hopefully Cleveland has this seasons sweetest lemonade, cause they'll need it
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:50 pm

criznit2009 wrote:Kind of surprising how the F.O's complete lack of addressing the OF (1B/LF) this off-season (they made a few dinky moves) has escalated so quickly. I'll take Damon, but he is no Willingham,Cuddyer, Beltran, Cepedes, Crisp (yikes!) - total failure by the powers in charge to get us a BAT. A RH'd one in particular that plays either OF or 1B. 100% complete total failure - no doubt. Hopefully Cleveland has this seasons sweetest lemonade, cause they'll need it


Johnny Damon posted a .326 OBP last year and a .743 OPS last year.

Coco Crisp posted a .314 OBP and .693 OPS last year.

I'll give you defense clearly goes to Crisp, but Damon is a better bat than Crisp, not sure how you can argue otherwise. Damon also doubled Crisp's HR total. Dont' get me wrong, wouldn't have hated Crisp on this team, but his bat has gone downhill, even moreso than Damon's. Plus, Crisp is another guy that just can't stay healthy. Did play 136 games last year (first time over 100 in 3 years)....Damon has never played in fewer than 140 since 1996...

I'll give you the other being better (though Willingham/Cuddyer not by much). Feel both the Rockies and Twins may have overpaid for both guys a bit though.


Not sure how the Tribe completely lacked addressing 1B/LF. They added Kotchman and Sizemore (Brantley was suppose to be in LF), plus numerous depth guys. You can argue the Tribe went after the wrong options (since Sizemore got hurt), but the Tribe pretty much solely focused on 1B/OF this winter (other than Lowe).
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby A.Zajac » Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:20 pm

@JonHeymanCBS Damon gets $1.25M plus $1.4M in perf. bonuses

Not bad at all..
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:53 pm

A.Zajac wrote:@JonHeymanCBS Damon gets $1.25M plus $1.4M in perf. bonuses

Not bad at all..


Considering Cunningham was making nearly half a mil and Spilbourghs would have made $1M if he was on the club I agree wholeheartedly, not bad at all. Will be interesting to see how this opt-out works though if it's indeed in there. Is the $1.25M for the whole year then too, meaning if he opts out in June we only pay a fraction of the cost?
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby A.Zajac » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:46 pm

Damon will report to the Tribe in 1-2 weeks.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Prosecutor » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:08 am

Damon was signed for his offense, but left field has not been the problem with the Tribe's offense.

They need Kotchman, Brantley, Kipnis, and Choo to start hitting.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:32 am

Prosecutor wrote:Damon was signed for his offense, but left field has not been the problem with the Tribe's offense.

They need Kotchman, Brantley, Kipnis, and Choo to start hitting.


Yes but lead off has been a problem and hopefully Damon corrects that.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:37 am

Damon is undoubtedly flawed but, from a 25-man roster standpoint, it would appear we're replacing Cunningham with Damon. So, that is a step forward offensively and a step back defensively...... a gamble probably worth taking with this teams issues.

Let's just hope the fact that the rotation is righty and ground ball heavy, that LF is gonna be a very quiet place in the Tribe OF.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:01 am

dazindiansfanuk wrote:Damon is undoubtedly flawed but, from a 25-man roster standpoint, it would appear we're replacing Cunningham with Damon. So, that is a step forward offensively and a step back defensively...... a gamble probably worth taking with this teams issues.

Let's just hope the fact that the rotation is righty and ground ball heavy, that LF is gonna be a very quiet place in the Tribe OF.


I agree the only thing in favor of keeping Cunningham would be that he would be the defensive replacement (as he has been for Duncan late in games where the team is ahead). This 25 man roster certainly has it's problems with being so lefty heavy and little defensive options in the OF. Offensively the team is better with Lopez than Cunningham but unless Donald can be a defensive option in LF.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:10 pm

No set opt out, just an agreement between Antonetti and Damon to address the issue if he's not getting enough ABs.

Damon is also starting on a minor league deal (figured this was happening).


Highly doubt the Tribe would do this as they need all the help on offense they can get...but I think sending Donald down for a week or two to AAA and calling up Carrera could be an idea. Have Donald play the CF/LF exclusively. When Damon is ready bring both he and Donald up sending Carrera back down and let Cunningham go. Again, don't think the Tribe will do this, but I just don't 'think we need Donald as a backup 3B to hit against lefties (as he did against Chicago). Hanny's OPS was nearly 140pts higher against lefties last year. Opening day he was one of the few bright spots off Romero. We need Donald's bat but we need it in the OF way more than infield right now IMO. I realize you can't learn to play the OF in just 10 days (time he'd have to stay down), but would be better than throwing him out there cold like we saw with Valbuena last year....
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby GhostofTedCox » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:05 pm

So anyway,,,
If we have Johnny Damon, or will have him in about a week to 10 days; where do we bat him?

If he's taking Duncan's spot, do we bat him 6th?
Or, with 19 SB last year, do we let a 38 year old bat leadoff?
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby daingean » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:16 pm

GhostofTedCox wrote:So anyway,,,
If we have Johnny Damon, or will have him in about a week to 10 days; where do we bat him?

If he's taking Duncan's spot, do we bat him 6th?
Or, with 19 SB last year, do we let a 38 year old bat leadoff?


Unless Brantley shows he can be productive at the lead off, I think Damon will man that spot.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:12 pm

GhostofTedCox wrote:So anyway,,,
If we have Johnny Damon, or will have him in about a week to 10 days; where do we bat him?

If he's taking Duncan's spot, do we bat him 6th?
Or, with 19 SB last year, do we let a 38 year old bat leadoff?


Age and stolen bases have nothing to do with hitting leadoff. Need to get on base. Damon struggled some last year with only a .326 OBP but still better than Brantley. He's a career .353 guy too with last year being the first time since 2003 that he was under .350. Unless Brantley really picks it up over the next week, you have to drop him IMO.
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby GeronimoSon » Sat Apr 14, 2012 6:00 pm

It will be at least a couple of weeks before Damon is moved to the ML roster.. By then, Brantley may have settled into his role as the starting CF'er and lead off guy.. He, like everyone except Travis Hafner, had some very good AB's yesterday afternoon in front of the sell out crowd for the Royals opener...
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Re: Damon to Tribe says Rosenthal

Postby TonyIBI » Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:39 am

I have no problem with the Indians signing Damon. It is for one year and cheap, so it doesn't hinder them financially at all. From a roster perspective he will help as he should help upgrade the outfield as he and Duncan could be a solid LF platoon...and of course Damon will play a lot more than a regular platoon player. Looks like he may in fact play some LF and CF, and I have to believe he will take the 40-man and 25-man spot of Cunningham when the time comes. Damon will not be a savior for the offense, but he definitely will help in bringing a professional approach to the lineup and some much needed leadership.

Like everyone else, I'd have preferred a right-handed bat that is proven....but they just are not out there right now. Indians have been looking under every nook and cranny for an outfielder. Three attempts for a legit outfielder fell through in the offseason (Willingham, Beltran, Lee) and that does not include several others they were trying to sign or trade for. Their trade currency is pretty weak, but I can see where some people believe they should just overpay to get a guy here and get the deal done. Problem is, is that does not always make a lot of sense either (i.e. Kerry Wood). You have to get the guys you want at the price you want, or close to it.
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