RSS Twitter Facebook YouTube
Expand Menu

PTBNL for Thome

Talk shop about the various prospects and teams that make up the Cleveland Indians organization.

PTBNL for Thome

Postby toledobuck » Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:55 pm

The PTBNL in the Thome trade needs to be named by 10/15. I am thinking that the Twins cannot expect too much back in a trade. It appears there may be a couple options for the PTBNL based upon if the Indians make the playoffs or not. Since it seems very unlikely that the Tribe makes the playoffs at this point (hope I'm wrong), I am expecting that the deal will be finalized by just shipping some cash back to MIN. If we somehow to make the playoffs I see the Tribe having to deal a decent but low upside relief pitcher in the lower minors like Saraniades.
toledobuck
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 253
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:07 am

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby elrod enchilada » Fri Aug 26, 2011 6:35 pm

After the Jimenez deal, I fear it might be Lindor or Wolters.
elrod enchilada
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 181
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 2010 10:16 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby entertheshoe » Fri Aug 26, 2011 6:38 pm

elrod enchilada wrote:After the Jimenez deal, I fear it might be Lindor or Wolters.


So funny I forgot to laugh.
entertheshoe
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:02 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Fri Aug 26, 2011 6:49 pm

If I was going to bet..... I'd say a guy like Paulo Espino.

It my drive Art carzy, but he fits the profile...... bit of a tweener guy with no real place in the system.
dazindiansfanuk
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1854
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:51 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby criznit2009 » Fri Aug 26, 2011 7:06 pm

Well we got McAllister for Kearns, and Thome is a good fit for the tribe right now so I think the twins probably held out for a guy they would at least kind of want. Could end up being any AA starter or guys like Moncrief/Monsalve possibly. We will see but I think it will be a pretty decent guy in a lot of respects. Real quality if we make the post season.
criznit2009
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1191
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 9:27 pm
Location: Portland, OR

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby jellis » Fri Aug 26, 2011 9:43 pm

dazindiansfanuk wrote:If I was going to bet..... I'd say a guy like Paulo Espino.

It my drive Art carzy, but he fits the profile...... bit of a tweener guy with no real place in the system.


I was thinking the exact same player
jellis
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 3016
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby Tondo » Fri Aug 26, 2011 10:21 pm

I hope it's Fedroff...maybe Valbuena? or Mills? Probably won't be 6year MiLB guys like Head or Goedert right? I suspect a RP spec like Langwell, Sturdevant, Guilmet or Burns
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 528
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby jellis » Fri Aug 26, 2011 10:23 pm

Tondo wrote:I hope it's Fedroff...maybe Valbuena? or Mills? Probably won't be 6year MiLB guys like Head or Goedert right? I suspect a RP spec like Langwell, Sturdevant, Guilmet or Burns



I hope not federoff, valbuena would be fine as would the other 6 year guys
jellis
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 3016
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby MadThinker88 » Fri Aug 26, 2011 10:32 pm

jellis wrote:
Tondo wrote:I hope it's Fedroff...maybe Valbuena? or Mills? Probably won't be 6year MiLB guys like Head or Goedert right? I suspect a RP spec like Langwell, Sturdevant, Guilmet or Burns



I hope not federoff, valbuena would be fine as would the other 6 year guys


Jellis,
Why not Federoff? Do you expect Tim to be added to the 40 man after the season (since he is eligible for the Rule 5 this offseason)?? Should the Tribe make the postseason, I could see a 'better' prospect heading back to the Twins.
MadThinker88
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1752
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:48 am
Location: Eau Claire, Wisconsin

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby Tondo » Fri Aug 26, 2011 10:33 pm

I like Fedroff but he just doesn't have any MLB tool imho...he has little speed and zero power...he's basically an OBP vs RHP guy as he struggles against LHP...Carrera is a much better option since he has +speed and better D...there's simply not much use for him, esp. in our LH OF....I would have nor problems givinghim away...we have similar players coming up in Holt and Henry (table setters with much better speed to boot)
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 528
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby jellis » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:34 pm

MadThinker88 wrote:
jellis wrote:
Tondo wrote:I hope it's Fedroff...maybe Valbuena? or Mills? Probably won't be 6year MiLB guys like Head or Goedert right? I suspect a RP spec like Langwell, Sturdevant, Guilmet or Burns



I hope not federoff, valbuena would be fine as would the other 6 year guys


Jellis,
Why not Federoff? Do you expect Tim to be added to the 40 man after the season (since he is eligible for the Rule 5 this offseason)?? Should the Tribe make the postseason, I could see a 'better' prospect heading back to the Twins.


I am ok with trying to sneak him through, he has had a nice rebound year and honestly hope we give up virtually nothing for Thome, I just happen to think Federoff growth this year, shows me he is finally maturing. I mean he was only a sophomore when he signed
jellis
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 3016
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby artgold » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:58 pm

Geez guys...if it is Espino just keep in mind the deal in 1966 where the Phillies sent a minor leaguer named Fergie Jenkins to the Cubs for the veteran Larry Jackson... :rofl:
artgold
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1101
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 1:00 am

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Aug 27, 2011 2:34 pm

There's the possibility it ends up a cash deal.

I'd guess one of the extra bullpen arms like Guilmet.
homerawayfromhome
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2436
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:17 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby TonyIBI » Sat Aug 27, 2011 5:31 pm

Yeah, good chance it ends up just cash....but if is it a player it is going to be a second or third division guy.
User avatar
TonyIBI
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:03 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Aug 27, 2011 6:35 pm

Gotta give CA :clapping: for making several deals this yr. The Tribe may end up just missing the playoffs bc of the volume of injuries and the timing but nonetheless it's good to see CA be aggressive in making moves and it bodes well for the future. CA is willing and aggressive rather than the passivity we have seen in the past in his approach to acq. talent and make / keep this team a contender. Although I have been critical of the Jimenez deal I completely understand the approach.

Thome may be just a rental but he adds pop to a weak lineup and brings energy to the fanbase. Good job by CA and co. getting this deal done. :good:
homerawayfromhome
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2436
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:17 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby Prosecutor » Sun Aug 28, 2011 6:57 am

The Twins are in the process of moving Joe Mauer to first base if I'm not mistaken. Catching is taking it's toll on his body and they need his bat in the lineup for a few more years. I think he has a long term deal for huge money.

Since the Tribe is deep in catching prospects I would not be surprised if the PTBNL turns out to be a catcher. Either that or a relief pitcher since the Tribe is loaded with RP prospects, too.

Teams aren't willing to give up top prospects for 3-month rentals anymore. No more Santana for Blake or Chris Perez for DeRosa deals. Still, you'd think Thome would be worth something. Heck, we got McAllister for Kearns and Zeke Carrera for Branyan. Thome is 2nd in the AL in OPS among full-time DH's. He's much better than Kearns or Branyan at the time they were traded.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 976
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby GeronimoSon » Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:24 am

Prosecutor wrote:The Twins are in the process of moving Joe Mauer to first base if I'm not mistaken. Catching is taking it's toll on his body and they need his bat in the lineup for a few more years. I think he has a long term deal for huge money.

Since the Tribe is deep in catching prospects I would not be surprised if the PTBNL turns out to be a catcher. Either that or a relief pitcher since the Tribe is loaded with RP prospects, too.

Teams aren't willing to give up top prospects for 3-month rentals anymore. No more Santana for Blake or Chris Perez for DeRosa deals. Still, you'd think Thome would be worth something. Heck, we got McAllister for Kearns and Zeke Carrera for Branyan. Thome is 2nd in the AL in OPS among full-time DH's. He's much better than Kearns or Branyan at the time they were traded.


Interesting comment.. no more Blake for Santana..

At the time of the trade, the Indians had fallen on their sword.. taken their dive... had traded CC Sabathia. Casey Blake was one of the more expensive veterans on the team that was going nowhere... The Indians traded Blake and most of the salary to the Dodgers, who were in a pennant race for both Jon Melong-gone, a AAA RHP that didn't seem like a bad prospect and Carlos Santana.. Up until 2008, the Dodgers had moved Carlos all over the place.. 2B, 3B, LF, RF, & C. In 2007, the Dodgers finally decided, sort of, to keep him as a catcher.. Carlos responded by batting .233 in Low A ball, a demotion from the previous year where he spent a mediocre year hitting poorly (down to .268 from .303 in 2006, with not much power) at High A ball. The "prospect" tag had surely begun to fade.. In 2008, Carlos got off to a very good offensive start in high A ball, but his catching skills were considered a loooooonggggg ways off.. With the kind of "up and down" career, a fading offense, the finalization of making Carlos a catcher, the long road ahead in the development of the skills necessary, and the need for a 3B (Casey Blake) at the ML level, the Dodgers decided to "sell high" on Carlos' good offensive start and were "THRILLED" to fleece the Indians for Casey Blake w/ the Indians even paying most of Casey's remaining contract.

That's really the way that trade went..and the rest, they say, is history.. oh, btw, the majority of the defensive inadequacies the dodgers identified with Carlos Santana, remain to this day..

Was this one of those "astute" trades by the Indians FO ? So far it looks that way.. It also looks that way w/ respect to the Chris Perez deal.. and it looks like that is the case with the astute trade of Garza to the Cubs for Archer (former tribe property).. How about Zach Wheeler for three months of Carlos Beltran?.. sort of looks the same. In other words.. I'm sure the Colorado Rockies will argue that their acquisition of Drew Pomeranz and Alex White is exactly one of these kinds of "astute deals". Trades like this have always happened in baseball and look for them to continue on these lines...
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3949
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby TitoFrancona » Sun Aug 28, 2011 12:13 pm

If I understand the rules correctly, the PTBNL can't be any player on the 40 man roster at the time of the trade so that leaves Valbuena out. I'm not comfortable with who that player is because so far, Antonetti is not above overpaying for veteran players.
TitoFrancona
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:18 pm

Re: PTBNL for Thome

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:03 am

TitoFrancona wrote:If I understand the rules correctly, the PTBNL can't be any player on the 40 man roster at the time of the trade so that leaves Valbuena out. I'm not comfortable with who that player is because so far, Antonetti is not above overpaying for veteran players.


Sort of.. as the "Pirates of the Caribbean" code goes.. the rules are more like 'guidelines'..

The PTBNL may not be an active ML'er during the time from the trade to the date the player is named. P'sTBNL are almost always minor league prospects--though sometimes a ML'er on the DL is the PTBNL. For this trade, the Twins received a list of players that will become the PTBNL or a cash settlement. At any rate, the player in question must be named within six months.

So, generally speaking, the PTBNL in the Thome deal should not be an active ML'er (on either the 25 man roster or the 40 man roster) but, the teams can agree to just about anyone or anything as long as the PTBNL doesn't appear in a ML game from the time of the trade to the time he's named.. The best example of "anything" is the PTBNL in the 1994 Dave Winfield trade to the Indians.. The Indians had to give the Twins a check for $ 100.00 and take their GM, Andy McPhail to dinner on John Hart's dime.. IT's a true story..you can look it up..
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3949
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm


Return to Indians Prospect Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest