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Paul Byrd

Postby dnosco » Fri Dec 05, 2008 8:00 am

No one mentioned this but Byrd is a Type B meaning we gave up the right to get a draft choice for him. He is now saying that he would like to pitch closer to his home in Atlanta, meaning that he would most likely not have been willing to accept arbitration. Time will tell how that plays out but we traded a few dollars (in baseball terms) for a draft pick. Now, you could say that we signed a bunch of 2008 draft picks for that money but if this team is so stretched for money that it has to sell players to sign draft picks then we have larger issues. Plus, we saved a bunch of money on trading CC and, to a much lesser extent, on some of Jason Michaels salary so that money should have been there anyway.

Plus this puts to rest the argument forwarded by a lot at the time that Byrd wasn't even going to be a Type B.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 10:02 am

All we saved was the major league minimum pro-rated on Michaels....less than what a mid-round draft pick would save.

We may also get a PTBNL in the Byrd deal still. That or more cash. Plus, Atlanta may offer Burnett a 5 year deal. If he'd take that Byrd won't likely be going to Atlanta and still may accept arbitration (though time is runnign out). It was a good move.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby TonyIBI » Fri Dec 05, 2008 1:44 pm

Byrd deal is done. Cash deal. Cash received was applied to the late draft signing spending spree which allowed them to go over their scouting budget.

I'll take the money saved on Byrd and used on some very good draft signings anyday over one possible comp pick in 2009.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby dnosco » Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:07 pm

Consigliere wrote:Byrd deal is done. Cash deal. Cash received was applied to the late draft signing spending spree which allowed them to go over their scouting budget.

I'll take the money saved on Byrd and used on some very good draft signings anyday over one possible comp pick in 2009.


Again, you saved money on CC. You saved money on Michaels, although not a lot. What kind of budget did we have if we spent at or below slot on almost everyone in the early rounds except for Haley? To me, the argument of getting extra money doesn't wash as we had extra money already and, in my opinion, we didn't pick the right guys who were available if we wanted to go on a spending spree.

You can RATIONALIZE what we did but you can't really justify it. We had already generated the money (from CC and Michaels) to sign all of those guys. Byrd's money was, in fact, just fluff money unless there is something I have forgotten about us picking all of CC's salary, which makes THAT deal less appealing than it already is.

In all your posts on this issue, Tony, I didn't see you factor in the money we saved on CC or rationalize the money we saved on Byrd and what we overpaid on draft slotting. You pretty much have to assume that Byrd's money went to over slot signings and, even if you can justify that you still have to rationalize CC's and Michaels' savings.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:25 pm

When was the deal finished? Last I read we were still looking to get more cash or a PTBNL.....do you have a link for it?



I'd rather take the $2M that we saved on Byrd than keeping him. Odds are the Tribe wouldn't have offered him arbitration so it would have been absoultley pointless to keep him.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby dnosco » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:56 pm

Hermie13 wrote:When was the deal finished? Last I read we were still looking to get more cash or a PTBNL.....do you have a link for it?



I'd rather take the $2M that we saved on Byrd than keeping him. Odds are the Tribe wouldn't have offered him arbitration so it would have been absoultley pointless to keep him.


Looking at the potential rotation guys next year, I think there SHOULD have been a great chance that, if we kept him, we would have offered him arbitration.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:01 pm

Then why aren't we looking at bringing him back right now? Probably because the Tribe wants to add someone better to the rotation. My guess is Shapiro would've been too nervous to offer him arbitration for fear of him accepting and having to pay him $8M next year....

Moot point; he's gone. Boston may get a sandwich pick for him. Good for them. They got what they wanted (backend starter), and Tribe got what they wanted (salary relief).
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby TonyIBI » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:02 pm

Here's all I will say, and you guys can carry on and debate this all you want. Byrd was traded August 12th. They signed all those guys August 14-15th. I was told by someone right after they signed all those guys that the money saved from Byrd was allocated to these signings. That's it. There is no rationalization needed, this is what happened.

As for the CC and Michaels money, I have no idea where that went. Those guys went bye-bye a long time before the draft or the signing deadline. If I am not mistaken though, the Indians budgeted for 2.5M in attendance, and only drew 2.16M, so I am sure the savings on those contacts went there.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby jellis » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:05 pm

I doubt they would have offered arb at the end of the day for him anyways, so we can argue till we are blue in the face but the cash relief allowed them to sign players they wouldnt have other wise signed
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby carnegie44115 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:14 pm

Yea I highly doubt the Indians would have offered him arb because yeah you get a compensation pick if he doesn't take it, but he earned 7.5 mil last year, and he didn't exactly have a horrible year, he had a good year, so you have to figure his arb salary probably would go up some, maybe it goes up to 8 or more, it would not be a good idea to throw that kind of money at Paul Byrd when he is 38, 3 years ago, maybe
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:40 pm

I don't think the Tribe would've offered Byrd arbitration and even if they did I'm not convinced he would have turned it down.

It's all well and good to say that he wants to pitch closer to his home in Atlanta, but he's already turned down more money (from KC) to sign with the Tribe, so he obviously has some affinity for the franchise and with the chance to make in excess of the $7m he earned in 2008 in 2009 then I think it would've been actually pretty likely that he would've accepted it.

If it was a choice between potentially getting a supplemental pick for him, or using the money saved to sign 4/5 high upside later round picks then I know which one I'd choose.

I'm not intimately aware of the Indians inner workings regarding their finances, so i don't know why they needed Byrds money to sign the draft picks, but it seems pretty clear to me that they did. With that in mind, not knowing why this money was needed elsewhere, I can't have any complaints.
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby jellis » Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:04 pm

a guy like house I think has the value of the pick we got from the extra bryd money anyways
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Re: Paul Byrd

Postby indianinkslinger » Sat Dec 06, 2008 8:12 pm

dnosco wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:When was the deal finished? Last I read we were still looking to get more cash or a PTBNL.....do you have a link for it?



I'd rather take the $2M that we saved on Byrd than keeping him. Odds are the Tribe wouldn't have offered him arbitration so it would have been absoultley pointless to keep him.


Looking at the potential rotation guys next year, I think there SHOULD have been a great chance that, if we kept him, we would have offered him arbitration.


Dennis, do you really believe that? I hope you are just taking a position because that makes no sense to me.
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