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The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

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The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby dnosco » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:09 am

My wife is a funny woman (you would have to have a sense of humor to have married me). She constantly mocks closers in maybe having to pitch 3 days in a row for, my gosh, an inning a day! Talk about abusing the guy's arm! Those guys certainly earn their money.

Now my wife knows baseball better than most wives do but she would probably be unsympathetic to CC Sabathia's situation.

Right about now I am thinking that the Brewers management and ownership are a bunch of low-lifes. First, in my opinion, they bully the Indians into taking a lower than market value deal for Sabathia. Now, we can and have debate that but what we can't debate is...

that the Brewers are totally abusing CC Sabathia. They know they won't have him next year and, no matter what happens short of a career-threatening injury, they will get their two draft picks for him this winter. They also have to know that overworking a pitcher can have long term effects on his career. Knowing all that they are riding him hard and putting him up wet. I think he has started 3 or 4 straight games on short rest, he pitched a complete game Sunday on short rest and will apparently pitch Thursday on short rest. He also has gone over 120 pitches a number of times, including Sunday in like his 4th start in a row on short rest. This abuse has been hinted at in the Plain Dealer multiple times.

I think this is just disgusting. The Brewers are abusing CC. They know they can't sign him and so they are going to drain every drop of ability out of him because they know it won't be their investment that is trashed if he goes down with an injury next year or in subsequent years. While this MAY not cost him money this winter I hope we all know that this type of thing can result in long-term damage to the player and, as a result, potentially to his career.

I hate to say it but if I was the Indians and had the means I STILL wouldn't sign CC this winter. Not that they have the means to do it but, even if they did, I think CC, with his injury history, has become a big question mark for the rest of his career based on this abuse.

I hope that this gets through all of baseball and no free agent of any standing EVER signs with the Brewers again. They are, in my opinion, the ultimate low-lifes of management in baseball for the way they are handling CC.

You have to have some integrity and care about the future of your players. The Brewers seem to only care about winning this year. That is almost unethical.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby TonyIBI » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:36 am

Yeah, no doubt that they are abusing Sabathia here.....but I don't think they care. Mission accomplished in getting to the postseason.

Buyer beware with Sabathia. He was severely over-worked this year with the high pitch counts and pitching when all is said and done possibly 5-6 times in a row on short rest. He'll end up piling up around 520-530 inning combined the last two years. That is a lot of mileage in two years. Someone will take the gamble though, like the Yankees who need pitching.

Just wish he would have pitched like this in last year's playoffs. :evil:
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:37 am

Whilst I'm not going to say that he hasn't been overworked (although he only averaged 110.6 pitches per start with MIL compared to 107.5 with CLE), I find it hard to lament the Brewers too much for doing it.

By all acounts CC came forward and volunteered to make his final 2/3 starts on short rest as he felt that the team needed him to give them the best shot of making the post-season.

If I was the Brewers and CC came to me and said that then I'd have no hesitation in starting him on short rest either ahead of the likes of Suppan and Bush.

Granted, it probably helps that they know he's not going to be around next year, but I still can't really hold it against them.

Also, when it comes down to it, do you really think it's going to affect the money CC makes on the open market next year?? If anything, I think he's raised his price by a hefty margin.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby jellis » Tue Sep 30, 2008 11:37 am

dnosco wrote:My wife is a funny woman (you would have to have a sense of humor to have married me). She constantly mocks closers in maybe having to pitch 3 days in a row for, my gosh, an inning a day! Talk about abusing the guy's arm! Those guys certainly earn their money.

Now my wife knows baseball better than most wives do but she would probably be unsympathetic to CC Sabathia's situation.

Right about now I am thinking that the Brewers management and ownership are a bunch of low-lifes. First, in my opinion, they bully the Indians into taking a lower than market value deal for Sabathia. Now, we can and have debate that but what we can't debate is...

that the Brewers are totally abusing CC Sabathia. They know they won't have him next year and, no matter what happens short of a career-threatening injury, they will get their two draft picks for him this winter. They also have to know that overworking a pitcher can have long term effects on his career. Knowing all that they are riding him hard and putting him up wet. I think he has started 3 or 4 straight games on short rest, he pitched a complete game Sunday on short rest and will apparently pitch Thursday on short rest. He also has gone over 120 pitches a number of times, including Sunday in like his 4th start in a row on short rest. This abuse has been hinted at in the Plain Dealer multiple times.

I think this is just disgusting. The Brewers are abusing CC. They know they can't sign him and so they are going to drain every drop of ability out of him because they know it won't be their investment that is trashed if he goes down with an injury next year or in subsequent years. While this MAY not cost him money this winter I hope we all know that this type of thing can result in long-term damage to the player and, as a result, potentially to his career.

I hate to say it but if I was the Indians and had the means I STILL wouldn't sign CC this winter. Not that they have the means to do it but, even if they did, I think CC, with his injury history, has become a big question mark for the rest of his career based on this abuse.

I hope that this gets through all of baseball and no free agent of any standing EVER signs with the Brewers again. They are, in my opinion, the ultimate low-lifes of management in baseball for the way they are handling CC.

You have to have some integrity and care about the future of your players. The Brewers seem to only care about winning this year. That is almost unethical.



its a business hes an investment and they dont care what happens down the line with him you make a deal and get a player, might as well get as much as you can. it doesnt seem like it bothers cc and he will still get his money so its not like it really matters
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby TonyIBI » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:08 pm

Yeah, whether or not he gets hurt in 2009 or beyond.....he is going to get well paid this offseason and likely break the bank with someone and get more than Santana got with the Mets.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby jellis » Tue Sep 30, 2008 4:02 pm

Consigliere wrote:Yeah, whether or not he gets hurt in 2009 or beyond.....he is going to get well paid this offseason and likely break the bank with someone and get more than Santana got with the Mets.



Then promptly break down, with his size and conditioning I expect some one to regret signing him. He misses time most seasons and there is a lot of innings in him already
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby indianinkslinger » Wed Oct 01, 2008 4:29 am

I think everyone is right in all respects but I just don't care. I hate to sound callous about the whole thing but CC has nothing to do with Cleveland any more. Milwaukee paid for him, fair and square. CC is pitching for Milwaukee of his own volition. The FA market is always "buyer beware". CC was a valuable part of the Indians and, IMO, a real class act. I don't wish him ill but he is history to me. Que sera, sera.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby jellis » Wed Oct 01, 2008 1:34 pm

indianinkslinger wrote:I think everyone is right in all respects but I just don't care. I hate to sound callous about the whole thing but CC has nothing to do with Cleveland any more. Milwaukee paid for him, fair and square. CC is pitching for Milwaukee of his own volition. The FA market is always "buyer beware". CC was a valuable part of the Indians and, IMO, a real class act. I don't wish him ill but he is history to me. Que sera, sera.



I think he might learn the grass is greener though both Cleveland and Milwaukee were laid back places that loved him. If he signs a huge deal with a huge market and then starts out like he did last year or doesnt start out like he is now, hes going to get buried and i will be intrigued to see how he responds
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby indianinkslinger » Wed Oct 01, 2008 4:19 pm

jellis wrote:
indianinkslinger wrote:I think everyone is right in all respects but I just don't care. I hate to sound callous about the whole thing but CC has nothing to do with Cleveland any more. Milwaukee paid for him, fair and square. CC is pitching for Milwaukee of his own volition. The FA market is always "buyer beware". CC was a valuable part of the Indians and, IMO, a real class act. I don't wish him ill but he is history to me. Que sera, sera.



I think he might learn the grass is greener though both Cleveland and Milwaukee were laid back places that loved him. If he signs a huge deal with a huge market and then starts out like he did last year or doesnt start out like he is now, hes going to get buried and i will be intrigued to see how he responds


I am pretty sure I agree with you but I can think of 150,000,000 reasons he will be able to live with his choice. You do have a higher opinion of Cleveland fans than I do but that's OT.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby jellis » Wed Oct 01, 2008 7:11 pm

indianinkslinger wrote:
jellis wrote:
indianinkslinger wrote:I think everyone is right in all respects but I just don't care. I hate to sound callous about the whole thing but CC has nothing to do with Cleveland any more. Milwaukee paid for him, fair and square. CC is pitching for Milwaukee of his own volition. The FA market is always "buyer beware". CC was a valuable part of the Indians and, IMO, a real class act. I don't wish him ill but he is history to me. Que sera, sera.



I think he might learn the grass is greener though both Cleveland and Milwaukee were laid back places that loved him. If he signs a huge deal with a huge market and then starts out like he did last year or doesnt start out like he is now, hes going to get buried and i will be intrigued to see how he responds


I am pretty sure I agree with you but I can think of 150,000,000 reasons he will be able to live with his choice. You do have a higher opinion of Cleveland fans than I do but that's OT.



don't know if I have a higher opinion just our fans are nothing like yankees fans when it comes to ripping on their players living in NYC I see how if you are merely average to good is not enough. I went to a few yankees games this year and it was pretty funny to just listen to the side conversations. I think he might end up 200000000 plus reasons to be happy when its all said and done
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby indianinkslinger » Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:09 pm

jellis wrote:
indianinkslinger wrote:
jellis wrote:
indianinkslinger wrote:I think everyone is right in all respects but I just don't care. I hate to sound callous about the whole thing but CC has nothing to do with Cleveland any more. Milwaukee paid for him, fair and square. CC is pitching for Milwaukee of his own volition. The FA market is always "buyer beware". CC was a valuable part of the Indians and, IMO, a real class act. I don't wish him ill but he is history to me. Que sera, sera.



I think he might learn the grass is greener though both Cleveland and Milwaukee were laid back places that loved him. If he signs a huge deal with a huge market and then starts out like he did last year or doesnt start out like he is now, hes going to get buried and i will be intrigued to see how he responds


I am pretty sure I agree with you but I can think of 150,000,000 reasons he will be able to live with his choice. You do have a higher opinion of Cleveland fans than I do but that's OT.



don't know if I have a higher opinion just our fans are nothing like yankees fans when it comes to ripping on their players living in NYC I see how if you are merely average to good is not enough. I went to a few yankees games this year and it was pretty funny to just listen to the side conversations. I think he might end up 200000000 plus reasons to be happy when its all said and done


Amen! Have a place in Manhattan and spend some time there. Love the atmosphere at Yankee games for the most part but the real kick is the midtown sports bars. I just find the level of criticism so much more informed and positive than what I see from Indian fans in general. And Yankee fans actually go to games!
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby osueddy » Sat Oct 04, 2008 9:40 am

Glad to see C.C. (or CC) continues to be clutch in the postseason.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby Jennifer » Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:58 pm

osueddy wrote:Glad to see C.C. (or CC) continues to be clutch in the postseason.
What's sad is no one can know whether he is clutchless or just finally ran out of gas the last two seasons. He was pretty clutch at the end of 2007 when the Tribe was trying to win a playoff spot and it is nearly impossible to imagine how a starter could be anymore clutch than he was this year for the Brewers.

Still if I were a GM thinking about signing him the timing of his meltdowns would worry me.
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Re: The shame of the Milwaukee Brewers

Postby jellis » Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:14 pm

Jennifer wrote:
osueddy wrote:Glad to see C.C. (or CC) continues to be clutch in the postseason.
What's sad is no one can know whether he is clutchless or just finally ran out of gas the last two seasons. He was pretty clutch at the end of 2007 when the Tribe was trying to win a playoff spot and it is nearly impossible to imagine how a starter could be anymore clutch than he was this year for the Brewers.

Still if I were a GM thinking about signing him the timing of his meltdowns would worry me.


dont forget this was his 3rd post season. We can make excuses about being young, or running out of gas, but it looks to me that he gets too amped up or nervous or something and just cant throw strikes. If he was gassed he wouldn't walk a ton of guys, and that happened both years. He just seems to not have it in him to be good in the post season
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