RSS Twitter Facebook YouTube
Expand Menu

Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Talk about the Cleveland Indians, Major League Baseball, and other sports.

Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:53 pm

Entering the series...
Indians: 51-48, 2nd place in AL Central, 2 GB the Tigers. 27-20 at home. 4-6 in last 10.
Angels: 55-47, 2nd place in AL West, 3 GB the Rangers. 27-24 on the road. 5-5 in last 10.
...The Indians have dropped 4 in a row and 6 of 8. The last time they were only 3 games over .500 was April 8th (5-2). They haven't been 2 games out of 1st place since losing the first 2 games of the season. Over the last 6 weeks, the Angels have posted the best record in the AL at 24-11. However, they haven't been able to keep up with the Rangers over the past 3 weeks, dropping from a share of 1st place on July 5th, to 3 games back.

Monday, 7:05 ET
Fausto Carmona, RHP (5-10, 5.63) vs. Dan Haren, RHP (10-6, 3.10)

Carmona has had a hard luck career against the Angels. He's had more success shutting them down than any other American League team, with a 1.79 ERA in 45.1 career innings, and yet with a 0-3 record, they remain the only AL team he's never beat. He'll try to build on last week's victory over the Twins, in which he allowed 2 runs over 6 innings for only his second win since May 3rd. • In his last 4 starts against Cleveland, Haren is 2-0 with a 1.88 ERA -- 1-0 with a 1.15 ERA in two games this season. The Indians hope to instead see the version of Haren who's posted a 9.28 ERA over his last two starts, while allowing 19 hits in 10.2 ip. Haren isn't quite the same pitcher on the road, where he's allowing opponents a run per game more (2.59 ERA at home, 3.63 on the road) than in Anaheim.

Tuesday, 7:05 ET
Josh Tomlin, RHP (11-4, 4.12) vs. Jered Weaver, RHP (13-4, 1.81)

Tomlin hasn't been as effective since the first two months of the season, but that hasn't stopped him from winning. He's 4-0 over last 7 starts, even going 1-0 while allowing a 7.36 ERA in his last two starts. The Indians have scored 5.5 runs/game in Tomlin's starts -- 9th highest in the AL and 1.1 runs/game more support than other Cleveland starter. However, Tomin will match up against one of the only 3 pitchers in the league with a higher winning percentage than him. • Weaver is one of the leading Cy Young candidates as the leader for the ERA title. He's also second among pitchers in WAR, tied for second in wins, and one of three AL starters with a sub-1.00 WHIP. He hasn't lost in his last 11 starts, going 7-0 with a 1.28 ERA, .514 OPS against, and logging at least 6.2 innings in every start.

Wednesday, 12:05 ET
David Huff, LHP (1-0, 0.00) vs. Ervin Santana, RHP (5-8, 3.69)

Due to Saturday's rain-out, Huff will be making his first start since last Monday, and just his second with the Tribe this year. He allowed 5 harmless hits and 2 walks, while shutting out the Twins for 7 innings in his season debut. He's pitched against the Angels just twice in his career, but lost both games, posting a 7.30 ERA in 12.1 ip. • Like Carmona, Santana is facing the only AL opponent he's never defeated. He's a career 0-6 vs. Cleveland, with a 4.98 ERA over 10 starts. Even when he allowed 3 runs in 7 innings against Cleveland on April 13th, in a 4-3 Angels victory, Santana left with a no-decision. However, he hasn't allowed more than 3 runs in any of his last 7 starts, posting a 2.42 ERA during that stretch.

NOTES:
• Orlando Cabrera's continued playing time -- hell, his continued employment -- is mystifying. He has 7 hits in his last 55 ab's (.127/.172/.145). Among all qualified AL hitters, he has the 3rd worst OBP, 4th worst OPS and OPS+, and no one in the AL draws fewer pitches per plate appearance at 3.25.
• With his next home run, Asdrubal Cabrera will have doubled his previous career total (18) in just this season.
• Michael Brantley is hitting .316/.337/.405 in July.
• Bobby Abreu is in a 2-for-23 slump and his .347 slg. pct. is his lowest since his first partial MLB season -- 13th worst in the AL -- but his .381 obp is still tied for the 9th best in the league.
• 19-year-old rookie Mike Trout is hitting .179/.238/.308 through his first 39 ab's, but hit his first MLB home run on Sunday. If Trout was playing for the Angels Single-A/Midwest League affiliate, he'd be the 2nd youngest player on the roster.
• At least the Indians don't owe Orlando Cabrera $70 million over the next 3+ years... if Vernon Wells had the 8 extra plate appearances to qualify, his .250 OBP would rank dead last among AL hitters, while his .219 BA would be 3rd worst. The Angels will have to look for comfort in Wells' power numbers and his .265/.282/.566 over his last 29 games.
• The Indians are scheduled to face the top 3 starters of the hardest AL rotation to score against (3.36), and it doesn't get any easier against the league's 3rd best bullpen (3.28).

Cleveland is 2-4 in their season series with the Angels.
4/11 • W • 4-0. Win: Talbot. Loss: Chatwood.
4/12 • L • 0-2. Win: Haren. Loss: Carmona.
4/13 • L • 3-4 (12). Win: Takahashi. Loss: Durbin.
5/6 • L • 1-2 (11). Win: Rodney. Loss: Germano.
5/7 • W • 4-3. Win: White. Loss: Weaver.
5/8 • L • 5-6. Win: Rodney. Loss: Smith.

SCOREBOARD WATCH
Tigers at White Sox

7/25: Duane Below (0-0, 1.80) vs. Mark Buehrle (7-5, 3.38)
7/26: Justin Verlander (13-5, 2.24) vs. Jake Peavy (4-4, 5.19)
7/27: Max Scherzer (11-5, 4.35) vs. John Danks (3-8, 3.92)
User avatar
Pork Chop Pough
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:09 pm

Bottom line.. the Indians need to load up on the LEFT HANDED hitters against this formidable Angels pitching staff. That means LaPorta could be the only RH hitter in the lineup tonight. ( Brantley, Carrera, Buck, Chisenhall, Droobs, Kipnis, Santana and Pronk at DH). The weather is going to be perfect for baseball..

The best time for players during the week before the trading deadline is when they're actually playing.. Hopefully, Carrera will be focused and will have his sunglasses on to start the game.....

Go Tribe.. we need to get a WIN now...
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby smt1192 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:21 pm

GeronimoSon wrote:Bottom line.. the Indians need to load up on the LEFT HANDED hitters against this formidable Angels pitching staff. That means LaPorta could be the only RH hitter in the lineup tonight. ( Brantley, Carrera, Buck, Chisenhall, Droobs, Kipnis, Santana and Pronk at DH). The weather is going to be perfect for baseball..

The best time for players during the week before the trading deadline is when they're actually playing.. Hopefully, Carrera will be focused and will have his sunglasses on to start the game.....

Go Tribe.. we need to get a WIN now...

Close, add Marson, take out LaPorta

July 25th
Carrera cf (L)
Brantley lf (L)
A Cabrera ss (S)
Hafner dh (L)
Santana 1b (S)
Chisenhall 3b (L)
Buck rf (L)
Kipnis 2b (L)
Marson ca (R)
smt1192
Undrafted Free Agent
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:07 pm
Location: Bedminster NJ / Raleigh NC

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:28 pm

Just to let G'Son or anyone else who'd like to fill in know... I'm not likely to be around enough to do the next 2 or 3 series previews. I've got my last summer trip coming up later this week, which includes a couple of baseball games in DC (haven't been to the new park, but mid-90ºs... thank God the rest of the trip is visiting my sister who just had a pool installed).
User avatar
Pork Chop Pough
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:59 pm

Pork Chop Pough wrote:Just to let G'Son or anyone else who'd like to fill in know... I'm not likely to be around enough to do the next 2 or 3 series previews. I've got my last summer trip coming up later this week, which includes a couple of baseball games in DC (haven't been to the new park, but mid-90ºs... thank God the rest of the trip is visiting my sister who just had a pool installed).

We'll have your back, PCP.. no problema, thanks for the heads up. oh.. put some sun screen on, that SE Coast sun can be BRUTAL on you ....
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby homerawayfromhome » Mon Jul 25, 2011 5:39 pm

@ Pork Chop Pough... good job as always. Enjoy the vacation time. :s_cool
homerawayfromhome
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2420
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby homerawayfromhome » Mon Jul 25, 2011 5:41 pm

The Tribe really needs to win this series and keep pace with the Central division hopefully by weeks end a cpl of reinforcements will be added.
homerawayfromhome
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2420
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Jul 25, 2011 7:37 pm

Indians flashing the leather early tonight...

-Zeke the streak with a great jump on a sinking liner to catch a ball.. diving to make the catch..

-Beautiful play off the wall by brantley to nail wells trying to stretch a single into a double..short hop catch and tag by Kipnis completed the deal..

-Fausto has to stop grooving pitches to get strikes when he's behind in the count.. that is going to be painful if he continues...

Early lead is a good thing.. nice hitting by Brantley.. good stroke by Droobs..

Beautiful night for a game..

After setting down the first two Angels in the third.. Fausto gave up a single to Macier Izturis. He then went to 3-0 on Hunter, a notorious Indians KILLER.. then came back and finished him off with three quality pitches.. Nice change from the first two innings...
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:11 pm

Welcome to the majors, Mr. Kipnis.

They needed to find some way to win this game... for a while there it looked they'd found a way to lose it instead.
User avatar
Pork Chop Pough
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Bearcatbob » Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:13 pm

Boy - we needed this one. Great ending. Props to Brantley - the key to the CC trade. Kip came through in the clutch.

Bob
Bearcatbob
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 618
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:10 am

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:21 pm

White Sox up on Detroit 5-2 in the 7th. Buehrle didn't pitch well at all, but managed to keep his team in it until the bats came around. Hopefully the Tribe is only 1 game out in another hour.

Minnesota is losing 18-1 in the 5th... the Rangers have scored at least 3 runs in each of the first 5 innings, and 8 of their 9 hitters already have a multi-hit game. The Twins are going to be at least 7 games out, are playing 3-4 guys every night who should be in AAA, and their best player is Joe Mauer, who can't hit for power now... they may want to think about becoming sellers yet this week. Even if they refuse to deal Michael Cuddyer, I'm sure they could get a couple prospects for Jason Kubel.
User avatar
Pork Chop Pough
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby criznit2009 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:53 pm

Pork Chop Pough wrote:White Sox up on Detroit 5-2 in the 7th. Buehrle didn't pitch well at all, but managed to keep his team in it until the bats came around. Hopefully the Tribe is only 1 game out in another hour.

Minnesota is losing 18-1 in the 5th... the Rangers have scored at least 3 runs in each of the first 5 innings, and 8 of their 9 hitters already have a multi-hit game. The Twins are going to be at least 7 games out, are playing 3-4 guys every night who should be in AAA, and their best player is Joe Mauer, who can't hit for power now... they may want to think about becoming sellers yet this week. Even if they refuse to deal Michael Cuddyer, I'm sure they could get a couple prospects for Jason Kubel.


The twins could make a case for trying to hold out for the division, but they would very very smart to look to sell. They could a mass quite a talent pool for themselves at the cost of Kubel and Cuddyer...Cuddyer is definitely a sell high kinda guy IMO, and they should. I think we would be interested. Also they have an arm or 2 that could get a decent enough spec.
criznit2009
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1190
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 9:27 pm
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:28 am

The magic is back !..

-Whew!!. what a finish.. congrats to the kid. Kipnis with the walkoff RBI single followed by a beating.. Hopefully he gets to experience several more over the remaining 62games... Tremendous swing on the double off the wall by PRONK. He continues to amaze with runners in scoring position.. close and late.. clutch..

-Onto Jared Weaver and his nasty assortment of pitches.. The Angels and Indians don't know how to play a game unless it includes a puree of Rolaids and Tums...

-Interesting notes by Manny Acta regarding Carrera.. he's the best defensive centerfielder in the Indians system.. He showed that early...

-Central Division Notes: Through 100 games, the Indians sport a snappy 52-48 record, let the scoreboard watching begin... Southsiders put a hurting on the Tigers to put the Indians within a game of the lead.. KC gets a W against the Red Sox.. and the Twins get hammered by the Rangers..
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Prosecutor » Tue Jul 26, 2011 2:25 pm

Kipnis was the hero at the end but there were a lot of heroes. Carmona pitched six scoreless innings. If he's finding his stride again it would be huge. Hafner had another clutch hit. But to me the biggest contributor was Brantley.

Brantley doubled in the first and scored, then threw out a guy at second who was trying for a double off the wall with nobody out. Since the next guy hit a double, Brantley's throw saved a run. Then in the 9th he singled, stole second, and scored the tying run.

So Brantley made huge contributions with his bat, his speed, and his defense, which directly contributed to two runs and saved another in a 3-2 win. This might have been his best game of the year, and it came when the Tribe desparately needed a win against one of the best pitchers in the league.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 976
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:27 pm

Prosecutor wrote:Kipnis was the hero at the end but there were a lot of heroes. Carmona pitched six scoreless innings. If he's finding his stride again it would be huge. Hafner had another clutch hit. But to me the biggest contributor was Brantley.

Brantley doubled in the first and scored, then threw out a guy at second who was trying for a double off the wall with nobody out. Since the next guy hit a double, Brantley's throw saved a run. Then in the 9th he singled, stole second, and scored the tying run.

So Brantley made huge contributions with his bat, his speed, and his defense, which directly contributed to two runs and saved another in a 3-2 win. This might have been his best game of the year, and it came when the Tribe desparately needed a win against one of the best pitchers in the league.

+1 across the board on your comments...

Kipnis was the hero at the end of the night... Brantley was the hero throughout the game. If this wasn't his best game of his short career.. it's in his top ten.. Fausto going 6 was another "baby step" in his progress back to being a consistent SP for this organization.. If he continues along with his starting pitching mates.. this could be the making of a hot streak at the right time.. and the right place.. Great plays and great results for the evening....
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:34 pm

Starting lineups for July 26th:

Carrera
Brantley
Asdrubal
Pronk
Santana
Chisenhall
LaPorta
Kipnis
Buck

The Tomlinator on the hill...

Aybar
Hunter
Abreu
Wells
Callaspo
Kendrick
Trumbo
Bourjos
Mathis

Jared Weaver on the hill...
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:46 pm

Manny's pregame presser comments...

-Manny's comments about last year's trading deadline: seems resigned to the belief that the guys that are here are staying and the guys in the media and blog-o-sphere aren't his concern..

-Alex White will have another simulated game before being sent out to start his rehab provided he has no set backs or issues with his finger. Then, it will be about his command. If he's on top of his game.. 3 or 4 outings and he could be back..

-Nice comments about Talbot & Tomlin: both have great approaches to pitching.. their toughness and maturity as pitchers. Tomlin needs to hit his spots to be effective, early or late in the count.

kind of a vanilla presser...perhaps it's the questions being asked?.
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 9:46 pm

Ugly game offensively for the Tribe. Hitting into 3 double plays, all in the last 4 innings. And that 9th...ugh, that to me is worse than a blown save in the 9th. Have to score at least 1 there.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Tondo » Wed Jul 27, 2011 7:16 am

What a bummer...especially if you don't know the score and watch the last 4 Inn as I did this morning...when the bases were loaded and the stream pretty much ended I knew it's not going to extra Inn...I was 99% sure we'd pull another walk off...how the hell can you GIDP there? inexcusable

We gotta lead the league in wasted QS the last 2-3 months...we're throwing away our chances at the POs by not getting that bat or 2 in here...Buck is an automatic out, so worthless...I have 0 faith in LaPorta when he gets to the plate, and he reinforced that by doing the worst thing possible in this game...it's hard enough to get by with 2 rookies being inconsistent and partly overmatched but having another 2-3 guys in there every day that look like rookies but shouldn't be anymore is just wasting a whole season

Hats off to Tomlin, our "BOR", who pitched another quality game...

Should have won this game, more hits, more base runners...huge bummer
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 527
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Bearcatbob » Wed Jul 27, 2011 7:36 am

Kipnis. Chis and perhaps Zeke nneed to play every day so that next year they have the experience they are missing. We need to get the rookie jitters (Phelps) out of the way THIS YEAR. This lineup cannot win a division - and I doubt one bat is going to fix it.

A very serious decision has to be made with LaPorta/Marson/Santana. LaPorta needs to play everyday - until he either sinks or swims. The whole team structure needs to be examined and redone.

Any bat trade should be for a guy who will be part of the team next year.

Bob
Bearcatbob
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 618
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:10 am

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby A.Zajac » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:22 pm

I was at the game last night... really boring game for much of the game and was going incredibly fast. Tomlin was cruising and deserved a lot better of a fate than he ended up with.

In the ninth with the bases loaded and no one out, as soon as LaPorta grounded into the DP, I turned to my friend and said I wish he would have just struck out. It was a total rally killer. Not to mention he didn't hustle to first to beat the DP.
Follow me on Twitter!
@AndrewIPI
User avatar
A.Zajac
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 3141
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 10:31 am
Location: Struthers, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:25 pm

Tondo wrote:What a bummer...especially if you don't know the score and watch the last 4 Inn as I did this morning...when the bases were loaded and the stream pretty much ended I knew it's not going to extra Inn...I was 99% sure we'd pull another walk off...how the hell can you GIDP there? inexcusable

We gotta lead the league in wasted QS the last 2-3 months...we're throwing away our chances at the POs by not getting that bat or 2 in here...Buck is an automatic out, so worthless...I have 0 faith in LaPorta when he gets to the plate, and he reinforced that by doing the worst thing possible in this game...it's hard enough to get by with 2 rookies being inconsistent and partly overmatched but having another 2-3 guys in there every day that look like rookies but shouldn't be anymore is just wasting a whole season

Hats off to Tomlin, our "BOR", who pitched another quality game...

Should have won this game, more hits, more base runners...huge bummer


Yeah I was actually very much expecting another walkoff there, or at worst a sac fly from LaPorta. Crazy as it sounds, he actually is a guy I wanted to see up there in that situation. He had 2 good at-bats against Weaver with some well hit balls including the HR (which when you look at Weaver's numbers was pretty amazing). Everything LaPorta was hitting was in the air. He's also 3rd on the team in sac flys and heading into that at bat had hit into the fewest DPs of any of the non-rookie callups on the team....with 1. I figured he'd at least hit a lazy fly medium deep that would have scored Cabrera. He actually layed off 2 pitches out of the zone too that in the past he probably swings at and then worked the count full. Definitely a bad finish to that game though...very frustrating.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:26 pm

wow, talk about a gift run there in the 1st for the Tribe.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby jellis » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:27 pm

Tondo wrote:What a bummer...especially if you don't know the score and watch the last 4 Inn as I did this morning...when the bases were loaded and the stream pretty much ended I knew it's not going to extra Inn...I was 99% sure we'd pull another walk off...how the hell can you GIDP there? inexcusable

We gotta lead the league in wasted QS the last 2-3 months...we're throwing away our chances at the POs by not getting that bat or 2 in here...Buck is an automatic out, so worthless...I have 0 faith in LaPorta when he gets to the plate, and he reinforced that by doing the worst thing possible in this game...it's hard enough to get by with 2 rookies being inconsistent and partly overmatched but having another 2-3 guys in there every day that look like rookies but shouldn't be anymore is just wasting a whole season

Hats off to Tomlin, our "BOR", who pitched another quality game...

Should have won this game, more hits, more base runners...huge bummer


People wonder why this argument won't die, I made my point just funny to see who has to keep attacking
jellis
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 3016
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:34 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:45 pm

Apparently neither team wants to play any defense today... :s_mad

Edit: Make that 3 errors for the Tribe in just over 3 innings...
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:45 pm

Make that 5 errors, one passed ball.. one earned run (three total) and no hits..

Watching ervin santana mow down the indians.. it was clear to see.. he was just on fire.. he didn't miss any spots in the zone..when he did, it was off the plate..

Huge Kudos to Ervin Santana for an absolutely wonderful pitching performance today.. Some Kudos to David Huff. His performance was more than good enough, on most days, to get the W....
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby daingean » Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:53 pm

GeronimoSon wrote:Make that 5 errors, one passed ball.. one earned run (three total) and no hits..

Watching ervin santana mow down the indians.. it was clear to see.. he was just on fire.. he didn't miss any spots in the zone..when he did, it was off the plate..

Huge Kudos to Ervin Santana for an absolutely wonderful pitching performance today.. Some Kudos to David Huff. His performance was more than good enough, on most days, to get the W....


even when facing a slumping team like the Indians right now, a no-hitter still takes a dominating performance. Hats off to you Mr. E.Santana.

This team needs more than 1 bat but that's for another thread. We shouldn't be targeting an elite guy but 2 or 3 serviceable bats (for lesser prospects). An elite bat will be pitched around on this team. We do have a lot of guys that can be replaced for guys that can have a .700 OPS rather than 1 .850 OPS guy.
daingean
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1538
Joined: Fri May 15, 2009 12:06 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Prosecutor » Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:59 pm

Glad I was at work today and missed this game.

The Tribe has now scored 6 runs in the last 5 games and is 1-4 in those games. If the front office wasn't feeling the pressure to make a trade for a bat before this week, they're really feeling it now.

Huff has a 0.71 ERA with one earned run allowed in 12.2 innings, although it must be noted that the Twins and Angels are two of the worst offensive teams in the AL. Carmona looked better than he has all year on Monday. I don't see a trade for a starting pitcher in the cards.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 976
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Tondo » Wed Jul 27, 2011 3:25 pm

- 7 runs in the last 5 games

- 14 runs allowed in last 5, never 5 or more, 4x 3runs or less

- 1-4 record, lost 6 of last 7

That #20 spec we're trying to save better get us to the POs in 3 years :wacko:

We're wasting a great pitching season, what a shame....you'll NEVER know if those guys still click the same way next year...should have gone for a bat as soon as Choo and Grady went down...1 bat, even 1 AB would have been the differene in those last 5 games...I'm blaming the FO for sitting on their hands and being cheap in a contending year....what's the goal of playing this game? IT's not about having a plethora of spec depth...what's it good for if you don't use it for your MLB team? We'll be easily losing 2 MLB RP arms in the rule 5 if we don't TRADE that depth for actual MLB talent....what are they waiting for? Yeah, you'll save a Monsalve in your deal, cool...but you've just lost 2-3 games which most probably will be the difference at season's end

Thank god that we will still have a Top 10 farm system and there's always next year...I guess...
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 527
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Wed Jul 27, 2011 3:35 pm

Tondo wrote:- 7 runs in the last 5 games

- 14 runs allowed in last 5, never 5 or more, 4x 3runs or less

- 1-4 record, lost 6 of last 7

That #20 spec we're trying to save better get us to the POs in 3 years :wacko:

We're wasting a great pitching season, what a shame....you'll NEVER know if those guys still click the same way next year...should have gone for a bat as soon as Choo and Grady went down...1 bat, even 1 AB would have been the differene in those last 5 games...I'm blaming the FO for sitting on their hands and being cheap in a contending year....what's the goal of playing this game? IT's not about having a plethora of spec depth...what's it good for if you don't use it for your MLB team? We'll be easily losing 2 MLB RP arms in the rule 5 if we don't TRADE that depth for actual MLB talent....what are they waiting for? Yeah, you'll save a Monsalve in your deal, cool...but you've just lost 2-3 games which most probably will be the difference at season's end

Thank god that we will still have a Top 10 farm system and there's always next year...I guess...
The Indians offered to pick up the remaining $ 6 MM on Beltran's contract as well as giving up a prospect.. and were rebuffed by his agent, BorASS. Boras didn't even inform Beltran of the offer, just rejected it out of hand.

Count on Boras handling the next couple of arbitration years with Shin-soo Choo in the same fashion.... It's not the front office's unwillingness to spend, it's the perception of the players about the city & the fans.. These prima dona's have a desire to play in front of a packed house of rabid fans watching winning baseball.. To get there.. the trade market will not be a viable source to achieve this end...
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:11 pm

This may have been the worst played game in Tribe history on the offense/defense side. no hits and 6 errors/passed balls? Are you kidding me? wow....

Hopefully we look back and say this was rock bottom though.


Huge series upcoming against the royals. Too early to say must wins with so many games against the AL Central to come including 12 still remaining with the Tiggers.....but feel like you almost have to sweep the lowly Royals here heading into the next roadtrip, which could be a killer.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:14 pm

Hermie13 wrote:This may have been the worst played game in Tribe history on the offense/defense side. no hits and 6 errors/passed balls? Are you kidding me? wow....

Hopefully we look back and say this was rock bottom though.


Huge series upcoming against the royals. Too early to say must wins with so many games against the AL Central to come including 12 still remaining with the Tiggers.....but feel like you almost have to sweep the lowly Royals here heading into the next roadtrip, which could be a killer.
Sweep would be sweet.. but winning the series is more realistic.. a string of them would be even sweeter...
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:15 pm

Tondo wrote:- 7 runs in the last 5 games

- 14 runs allowed in last 5, never 5 or more, 4x 3runs or less

- 1-4 record, lost 6 of last 7

That #20 spec we're trying to save better get us to the POs in 3 years :wacko:

We're wasting a great pitching season, what a shame....you'll NEVER know if those guys still click the same way next year...should have gone for a bat as soon as Choo and Grady went down...1 bat, even 1 AB would have been the differene in those last 5 games...I'm blaming the FO for sitting on their hands and being cheap in a contending year....what's the goal of playing this game? IT's not about having a plethora of spec depth...what's it good for if you don't use it for your MLB team? We'll be easily losing 2 MLB RP arms in the rule 5 if we don't TRADE that depth for actual MLB talent....what are they waiting for? Yeah, you'll save a Monsalve in your deal, cool...but you've just lost 2-3 games which most probably will be the difference at season's end

Thank god that we will still have a Top 10 farm system and there's always next year...I guess...


Yeah, the Tribe has been sitting on their hands? Really? c'mon now


As far as not trading Pom, our top 20 spec. meh, I for one am ecstatic that we did not deal him Beltran. Hell, I would be slightly upset if he's dealt for Pence.

Many times the best deal is the one you don't make.....like balking at Lincecum for Rios.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby GeronimoSon » Thu Jul 28, 2011 9:55 am

Hermie13 wrote:
Tondo wrote:- 7 runs in the last 5 games

- 14 runs allowed in last 5, never 5 or more, 4x 3runs or less

- 1-4 record, lost 6 of last 7

That #20 spec we're trying to save better get us to the POs in 3 years :wacko:

We're wasting a great pitching season, what a shame....you'll NEVER know if those guys still click the same way next year...should have gone for a bat as soon as Choo and Grady went down...1 bat, even 1 AB would have been the differene in those last 5 games...I'm blaming the FO for sitting on their hands and being cheap in a contending year....what's the goal of playing this game? IT's not about having a plethora of spec depth...what's it good for if you don't use it for your MLB team? We'll be easily losing 2 MLB RP arms in the rule 5 if we don't TRADE that depth for actual MLB talent....what are they waiting for? Yeah, you'll save a Monsalve in your deal, cool...but you've just lost 2-3 games which most probably will be the difference at season's end

Thank god that we will still have a Top 10 farm system and there's always next year...I guess...


Yeah, the Tribe has been sitting on their hands? Really? c'mon now


As far as not trading Pom, our top 20 spec. meh, I for one am ecstatic that we did not deal him Beltran. Hell, I would be slightly upset if he's dealt for Pence.

Many times the best deal is the one you don't make.....like balking at Lincecum for Rios.


-"Sitting on their hands" is french for, do something, it doesn't matter what it is.. Sorry, that's not how the Indians front office rolls.. hasn't rolled that way with Mr Jacobs as the owner and won't roll that way with Mr Dolan as the owner.

-Pom not being dealt for a two month Beltran Rental or Pence Acquisition: +1

There is still 54 hours to the trading deadline.. silently into thy goodnight..
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3937
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Tondo » Thu Jul 28, 2011 10:17 am

GeronimoSon wrote:
-"Sitting on their hands" is french for, do something, it doesn't matter what it is.. Sorry, that's not how the Indians front office rolls.. hasn't rolled that way with Mr Jacobs as the owner and won't roll that way with Mr Dolan as the owner.

-Pom not being dealt for a two month Beltran Rental or Pence Acquisition: +1

There is still 54 hours to the trading deadline.. silently into thy goodnight..


yeah...and hasn't rolled to a WS too

and who wanted to deal Pom or any top 4 spec for Beltran-rental? Not me for sure...I only deal 1 of the top guys for prime year players under control through 2013...I've made that clear enough I think
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 527
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:16 pm

Tondo wrote:
GeronimoSon wrote:
-"Sitting on their hands" is french for, do something, it doesn't matter what it is.. Sorry, that's not how the Indians front office rolls.. hasn't rolled that way with Mr Jacobs as the owner and won't roll that way with Mr Dolan as the owner.

-Pom not being dealt for a two month Beltran Rental or Pence Acquisition: +1

There is still 54 hours to the trading deadline.. silently into thy goodnight..


yeah...and hasn't rolled to a WS too

and who wanted to deal Pom or any top 4 spec for Beltran-rental? Not me for sure...I only deal 1 of the top guys for prime year players under control through 2013...I've made that clear enough I think


You said #20 spec.....assumed you had to mean top 20 in all of baseball becuse if you actually thought the Indians' #20 spec would get an impact bat like Beltran then wow....
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Tondo » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:23 pm

You misunderstood..and I wasn't very clear, so my bad I guess...I was talking about the difference in getting a deal done when Sizemore and Choo went doen to NOW...in those 2-3 weeks we lost meaningful ground in the PO race despite pretty good pitching...1 or 2 bats could have easily been the difference in some of those close losses

So, for the record...we might have "saved" including a #20 spec like Monsalve now that some sellers may have to settle for less BUT that could have cost us a postseason appearance
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 527
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:25 pm

Tondo wrote:You misunderstood..and I wasn't very clear, so my bad I guess...I was talking about the difference in getting a deal done when Sizemore and Choo went doen to NOW...in those 2-3 weeks we lost meaningful ground in the PO race despite pretty good pitching...1 or 2 bats could have easily been the difference in some of those close losses

So, for the record...we might have "saved" including a #20 spec like Monsalve now that some sellers may have to settle for less BUT that could have cost us a postseason appearance


yikes...so you actually think including a guy like Monsalve 2 weeks ago would have gotten us a better bat? no way
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Tondo » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:30 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
Tondo wrote:You misunderstood..and I wasn't very clear, so my bad I guess...I was talking about the difference in getting a deal done when Sizemore and Choo went doen to NOW...in those 2-3 weeks we lost meaningful ground in the PO race despite pretty good pitching...1 or 2 bats could have easily been the difference in some of those close losses

So, for the record...we might have "saved" including a #20 spec like Monsalve now that some sellers may have to settle for less BUT that could have cost us a postseason appearance


yikes...so you actually think including a guy like Monsalve 2 weeks ago would have gotten us a better bat? no way


Oh my....no, a guy like Monsalve 2 weeks ago would have gotten us the SAME bats that we'd get now without including him...THAT was my point...do I really have to spell out everything for you to get a point? I could also say: I would have sacrificed an additional spec (like a Monsalve) to get that bat ASAP in Cleveland because we needed 1 in those 3 weeks...we opted to wait it out/play it out with the crap trifecta of Kearns/Buck/Duncan in ADDITION to 3 rooks...that HAD to fail...should have been more proactive...now we're in "too little too late" land
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 527
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:34 pm

Tondo wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:
Tondo wrote:You misunderstood..and I wasn't very clear, so my bad I guess...I was talking about the difference in getting a deal done when Sizemore and Choo went doen to NOW...in those 2-3 weeks we lost meaningful ground in the PO race despite pretty good pitching...1 or 2 bats could have easily been the difference in some of those close losses

So, for the record...we might have "saved" including a #20 spec like Monsalve now that some sellers may have to settle for less BUT that could have cost us a postseason appearance


yikes...so you actually think including a guy like Monsalve 2 weeks ago would have gotten us a better bat? no way


Oh my....no, a guy like Monsalve 2 weeks ago would have gotten us the SAME bats that we'd get now without including him...THAT was my point...do I really have to spell out everything for you to get a point? I could also say: I would have sacrificed an additional spec (like a Monsalve) to get that bat ASAP in Cleveland because we needed 1 in those 3 weeks...we opted to wait it out/play it out with the crap trifecta of Kearns/Buck/Duncan in ADDITION to 3 rooks...that HAD to fail...should have been more proactive...now we're in "too little too late" land


Oh he would have? Really?

Fact is teams don't like trading assets until closer to the deadline. Throwing in a spec like Monsalve wasn't goint to be close to enough to change that. Do we really have to spell that out for you?

Betemit was the best bat dealt prior to yesteday. You don't think other teams tried adding a Monslave type of player to get a deal done sooner? c'mon now

While I have no proof, I all but guarantee it wasn't the Tribe waiting to make a deal, but the teams with the players waiting to find the best deal. A Monslave type won't make them be like "o man, we have to take THIS deal 3 weeks before the deadline!". Sorry, but deals for impact bats almost always occur within 4-5 days of the deadline.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby TonyIBI » Thu Jul 28, 2011 1:53 pm

Tondo wrote:You misunderstood..and I wasn't very clear, so my bad I guess...I was talking about the difference in getting a deal done when Sizemore and Choo went doen to NOW...in those 2-3 weeks we lost meaningful ground in the PO race despite pretty good pitching...1 or 2 bats could have easily been the difference in some of those close losses

So, for the record...we might have "saved" including a #20 spec like Monsalve now that some sellers may have to settle for less BUT that could have cost us a postseason appearance


The point being lost in all this is that other teams were sitting on their hands. If the Indians could force another team to make a move, it would have been done 3-4 weeks ago as the Indians were ready then. Other teams have been holding out for the moon for players, so unless the Indians were to significantly overpay, this is why it has taken so long for them and all the other teams to start getting the trade machine working.
User avatar
TonyIBI
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:03 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Tondo » Thu Jul 28, 2011 2:08 pm

I understand...and I said I was WILLING to overpay by throwing in a 15-25 spec to get it done...now sure, a spec like that would not have made a difference for a Pence or Beltran...but I guess we could have gotten Fukudome or a Willingham earlier in here. I think it's a chess game with both sides doing lateral moves (asking too much, offering low) knowing there's time left...our hand was forced though, so we could have made it more clear as in: "this is it, we NEED an OF NOW and our offer won't get better...if you make us wait another 2 weeks, take spec X from the offer"

I understand that it takes 2 to tango and also udnerstand that sellers hold out but it's not always the best move...if, as a buyer, you make your urgency clear enough something would have gotten done I'm sure...esp. for 2nd level players like Willingham, Fukudome etc...I really think they thought they'd get by with Kearns/Buck as they showed some life at that time if I remember correctly. Betemit didn't cost the moon and he's a career .777 OPS 3B...Inge was the Tigers equivalent to Buck in their lineup...they did something about it, quick and cheap...since then DET is 4-2, with 1 game lierally won by him with a tie breaking RBI in the 8th....look up our record since Sizemore went down...and now you know why we're 2 games behind all of a sudden

That's my problem...we approached the dedline like in year's past in "sellers" mode, waiting...waiting, more waiting...meanwhile we might have thrown away a great pitching season....and we all know it's not a sure thing to remain that way the upcoming seaons..after all, who thought our pitching would be any good before this season? See? A FO has to act accordingly to the situation his team is in....we were a division leading, PO-contending team when Sizemore went down and should have struck a deal the next day...not praying our SP and bullpen mafia (which humanly lost 2-3 games in that span, cant expect perfectness every time out and they had no room for mistakes) would cruise us along .500 to the deadline and help cover up playing washed up Buck/Kearns and 3 rooks every day...whatever they were thinking, it failed miserably...the worst part is that the downward trend was there before that
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 527
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: Angels at Indians, July 25, 26 & 27

Postby Hermie13 » Thu Jul 28, 2011 7:13 pm

Tondo wrote:That's my problem...we approached the dedline like in year's past in "sellers" mode, waiting...waiting, more waiting...meanwhile we might have thrown away a great pitching season....and we all know it's not a sure thing to remain that way the upcoming seaons..after all, who thought our pitching would be any good before this season? See? A FO has to act accordingly to the situation his team is in....we were a division leading, PO-contending team when Sizemore went down and should have struck a deal the next day...not praying our SP and bullpen mafia (which humanly lost 2-3 games in that span, cant expect perfectness every time out and they had no room for mistakes) would cruise us along .500 to the deadline and help cover up playing washed up Buck/Kearns and 3 rooks every day...whatever they were thinking, it failed miserably...the worst part is that the downward trend was there before that


For WHO?

Who as available for a trade that we should have gotten that next day? And after you name that player, explain why that team would give the Tribe that player and not wait a few days or even weeks to see if they couldn't get more for that player from another team. Even if we threw in an extra guy...why wouldn't they still go and see if they couldn't get another team to throw in an even better prospect?

Really dont' see how we approached this deadline as if we were in "sellers" mode. Every account out there said the Tribe were being very aggressive.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH


Return to Beyond The Minors

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

cron