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What are we doing in first place?

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What are we doing in first place?

Postby Prosecutor » Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:49 am

If somebody told me in March that the Tribe would be in first place on July 4th with these numbers I'd never have believed it.

Choo .244 5 HRs, 28 RBI
LaPorta .242/8/31
Sizemore .227/8/24
Santana .227/12/38
Hannahan .213/5/21
Kearns .196/0/2
Marson .226/0/7

Carmona 4-10, 5.78 ERA
Talbot 2-5, 5.60 ERA

I'd say it's mostly a combination of good pitching (especially the bullpen), good defense, the Return of Pronk (Tribe is 22-13 when he starts), an All-Star season by ACab, a horribly weak A.L. Central, and a damn good job by the manager.
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Re: What are we doing in first place?

Postby GeronimoSon » Mon Jul 04, 2011 8:09 am

Prosecutor wrote:If somebody told me in March that the Tribe would be in first place on July 4th with these numbers I'd never have believed it.

Choo .244 5 HRs, 28 RBI
LaPorta .242/8/31
Sizemore .227/8/24
Santana .227/12/38
Hannahan .213/5/21
Kearns .196/0/2
Marson .226/0/7

Carmona 4-10, 5.78 ERA
Talbot 2-5, 5.60 ERA

I'd say it's mostly a combination of good pitching (especially the bullpen), good defense, the Return of Pronk (Tribe is 22-13 when he starts), an All-Star season by ACab, a horribly weak A.L. Central, and a damn good job by the manager.


There is no doubt, the bullpen mafia has excelled beyond where even the most optimistic friend of the feather could have imagined..this is one of two areas the Indians have excelled.

Alas..w/ Manny's leadership (as you've astutely pointed out), the key to the Indians success..wasn't overall numbers.. or the return of former heroes.. it was quite simply clutch hitting.. i.e. BA w/RISP. Take away that lousy 9 out of 10 or 12 out of 14 game losing skid, and no other team in MLB hit as well as the Indians w/RISP. The defense has been okay, nothing great.. the offense has been okay, nothing great.. the starting pitching has been okay, nothing great.. but, the HITTING w/ RISP.. has been the key, especially in the first 45 games. Even though we all know that Tommy Hamilton begrudgingly gives in to hyperbole, he's been heard talking about the "..old jacobs field magic.." from time to time.. Even the casual fan won't turn the games off when the Indians are trailing... why?.. because they can and have won those games..

If the Indians are ahead and fans want to see if our Wahoo's can hang on?.. Well, the bullpen for the Indians make it boring..they close the door.. they slam the damn thing shut..

If the Indians are behind.. the fans know the Sons of Geronimo can come back and win in their last at bat.. it's happened before.. and it will again..knock on wood...

Go Tribe !!..
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Re: What are we doing in first place?

Postby jellis » Wed Jul 06, 2011 2:58 pm

answer is simply we are in far and away the worst division is baseball, look at the run differential, any other division we are 2nd if not 3 or 4th
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Re: What are we doing in first place?

Postby criznit2009 » Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:04 pm

jellis wrote:answer is simply we are in far and away the worst division is baseball, look at the run differential, any other division we are 2nd if not 3 or 4th


Not sure I would call it the "worst"......... I prefer to call it the "most winnable" division... wonder what the price for Rivera is up to now?? Talbot+Gardner+EZ Carrera+ PTBNL/cash = done?
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Re: What are we doing in first place?

Postby entertheshoe » Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:14 pm

jellis wrote:answer is simply we are in far and away the worst division is baseball, look at the run differential, any other division we are 2nd if not 3 or 4th


Minnesota being -69 really throws off the run differential. I think everyone can agree that they're not the 4th worst team in baseball (if run differential is how you determine that). Interestingly, the Tribe has a better record against the AL East (13-11) and interleague (11-7, without even having Travis Hafner) than they do versus the AL Central (13-12). I disagree that the AL Central is "far and away" the worst division in baseball. Record-wise maybe but the White Sox and Twins are drastically underperforming and I wouldn't count on them continuing that for the rest of the season. Not enough evidence imo to say it's the worst division and just looking at records or run differential isn't a great way to determine it. Stick 5 New York Yankees in the same division and they all have .500 records with a 0 run differential.

I like what criznit said: most winnable, at least based off the first half of the season
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Re: What are we doing in first place?

Postby Tondo » Wed Jul 06, 2011 4:08 pm

criznit2009 wrote:wonder what the price for Rivera is up to now?? Talbot+Gardner+EZ Carrera+ PTBNL/cash = done?


Wow, that's way too much for a 3 month rental imho...Rivera isn't even producing and had a bad 2010 to boot...we got Carrera and Diaz for Branyan, who had a .800+ OPS at the time...comparable imho: aging, declining platoon vet up for rental trade...I know I was pretty happy with Carrera and Diaz as that was much more than I though we'd get

That said...I'd do whatever to save Carrera, I would not trade any Top20 spec to be honest...they can have Talbot+Fedroff+Judy, which imho is already overpaid but we would only lose "quality fat", I'd much rather give up 1 more spec than lose a Top 20 guy, and Carrera imho is a 15-20 talent even in this system, guy gets on base and steal bases and plays fantastic CF, I see a Bourn-like player...and we need him as soon as this season and he's pretty much our no4 OF for next and a solid fallback option should Brantley somehow fail/get injured

As I see it, we have as good or better options at AAA than Talbot...Carrera, Henry > Fedroff, who has no above AVG tools, lots of table setters coming up....Judy is a fine BP arm but I consider Lee, Putnam, Hagadone as good or better coming up...not to mention Burns, Langwell etc knocking....it would be a nice group of ML ready players for Toronto, bolstering much needed depth at worst...if they want more upside than Talbot, they can have a A+ or AA SP (not Pom of course)...but I'd hate to sell low on a guy like Gardner or Adams

Remember, most BJays fans are happy to get a couple C+ specs for Rivera, who didn't produce, is overpaid and wouldn't come back anyway (think us with Branyan last year and he wasnt that bad and overpaid)
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