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Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:15 pm

If the tribe doesn't add a bat Jimenez is useless.
Jimenez, 27 had a 46 groundball rate, he has a 4.20 era this yr with 8.6 k/9 and 3.5 w/9 ... his contract is what enticed the Tribe $4.2 m in 12, $5.75 m option in 13 and a $8 m option 14.

Tribe gains 3 yrs of JImenez for
12 yrs of White and Pomeranz.
Don't like it.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:15 pm

... and now someone is reporting that Ubaldo is headed to the bullpen to start.

WHAT'S GOING ON?
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:18 pm

Sources: #Indians, on verge of acquiring Jimenez, also in position to acquire #Padres Ludwick later tonight or in AM.


http://twitter.com/#!/ScottMCBSSports/s ... 4008581121
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:21 pm

Mlbtraderumors reporting Jimenez to TRibe ???? Jimenez warming in pen.

LUdwick likely to tribe also being reported.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:26 pm

dazindiansfanuk wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:
dazindiansfanuk wrote:I'm torn.

Ubaldo is a helluva talent..... but, they've given up a LOT of pitching talent to get him if the deal is as reported.

Damn, Antonetti isn't shy if that's the case!


I'm not torn...if it's indeed Pom and White then I hate this deal for the Tribe. Ubaldo is not a helluva a talent. He's a #3 starting pitcher who had one great 1st half in 2010. Other than that, he's been good but never great.


He is a helluva talent....by no means has he turned that talent into ace consistency but the talent is still there.

I'm not a fan of the deal as reported but, to be the other side of these deals is a change that's for sure.


Yeah guess that's true. But reports of a loss in velocity on top of the fact he's not really an Ace....not liking this deal at all at the moment.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:29 pm

entertheshoe wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:
dazindiansfanuk wrote:I'm torn.

Ubaldo is a helluva talent..... but, they've given up a LOT of pitching talent to get him if the deal is as reported.

Damn, Antonetti isn't shy if that's the case!


I'm not torn...if it's indeed Pom and White then I hate this deal for the Tribe. Ubaldo is not a helluva a talent. He's a #3 starting pitcher who had one great 1st half in 2010. Other than that, he's been good but never great.


People knock Ubaldo's season but check out his away splits:

2.83 ERA, 60 innings pitched, 38 hits (only 1 home run), 65 strikeouts, .178 average

compare that to

5.55 ERA, 61 innings pitched, 78 hits (9 HR), 51 strikeouts, .310 average

Let's just hope it's the elevation. I know people talk about it being hitter friendly but damn.


Check his splits though in 2010; not a real difference. We'll see if it was Colorado this year I guess. But Coors isn't as big a HR park as it once was. Heck, Progressive Field is more homer prone this year. I'm not as sold Ubaldo will turn it around by simply leaving Coors Field.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:54 pm

Jimenez is on the mound now for Rox. They have Esmil Rogers pitching on the side in case a trade happens.

Maybe Matt McBride goes to Padres for Ludwick.
Rox announcers are talking Pomeranz, White, Kipnis, Chisenhall and McBride all on the table for Jimenez.
Jimenez is obviously shaken on mound... Walks first batter and behind second...allowed an easy stolen base.

Deal would be stupid to include big 4 maybe one and a pkg but all would be stupid.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:00 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
entertheshoe wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:
dazindiansfanuk wrote:I'm torn.

Ubaldo is a helluva talent..... but, they've given up a LOT of pitching talent to get him if the deal is as reported.

Damn, Antonetti isn't shy if that's the case!


I'm not torn...if it's indeed Pom and White then I hate this deal for the Tribe. Ubaldo is not a helluva a talent. He's a #3 starting pitcher who had one great 1st half in 2010. Other than that, he's been good but never great.


People knock Ubaldo's season but check out his away splits:

2.83 ERA, 60 innings pitched, 38 hits (only 1 home run), 65 strikeouts, .178 average

compare that to

5.55 ERA, 61 innings pitched, 78 hits (9 HR), 51 strikeouts, .310 average

Let's just hope it's the elevation. I know people talk about it being hitter friendly but damn.


Check his splits though in 2010; not a real difference. We'll see if it was Colorado this year I guess. But Coors isn't as big a HR park as it once was. Heck, Progressive Field is more homer prone this year. I'm not as sold Ubaldo will turn it around by simply leaving Coors Field.


That right there is where the velocity loss likely comes into play. As we all know, in Colorado there is much much less movement on pitches.

@ Colorado: less velocity + less movement due to elevation = 5.55 ERA
@ anywhere else: less velocity + same movement = 2.83 ERA

:dunno:
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:05 pm

Heyman reporting it's now a 4-for-1 deal..... oh boy!
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:08 pm

dazindiansfanuk wrote:Heyman reporting it's now a 4-for-1 deal..... oh boy!


Maybe that 4th player is Orlando Cabrera. Or Chad Durbin. Or Frank Herrmann. Or Austin Kearns?
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:10 pm

entertheshoe wrote:
dazindiansfanuk wrote:Heyman reporting it's now a 4-for-1 deal..... oh boy!


Maybe that 4th player is Orlando Cabrera. Or Chad Durbin. Or Frank Herrmann. Or Austin Kearns?


ha, we would need to make a 40-man roster move for him somehow so one of them would do that. Though think you're being a little too hopeful there :drinks:
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:11 pm

Rox dugout saying goodbyes to Jimenez.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:13 pm

Absolutely hate it. I like Jimenez but not wise to give up 2 top tier pitching prospects. Iannetta not catching tonight btw. Hmmmm. Could he be included?
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:16 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
entertheshoe wrote:
dazindiansfanuk wrote:Heyman reporting it's now a 4-for-1 deal..... oh boy!


Maybe that 4th player is Orlando Cabrera. Or Chad Durbin. Or Frank Herrmann. Or Austin Kearns?


ha, we would need to make a 40-man roster move for him somehow so one of them would do that. Though think you're being a little too hopeful there :drinks:


Yea I was being uber sarcastic.

Looks like the trade is final.

Not sure what to think of it. Let's hope Ubaldo finds himself here, at least he's locked up until 2013, possibly 2014.

Not crazy about what we gave up, but I like how the front office just sent the message that we want to win NOW.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:22 pm

2014 is player voidable with trade.

Joe Gardner added to sweeten Rox pot.

TrIbe fans better start praying this pays off.

I'm not a fan of it 12 years of White and Pomeranz for 2 /3 Jimenez great. :s_mad
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:26 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:2014 is player voidable with trade.

Joe Gardner added to sweeten Rox pot.

TrIbe fans better start praying this pays off.

I'm not a fan of it 12 years of White and Pomeranz for 2 /3 Jimenez great. :s_mad


Well, Ubaldo is most likely a type A free agent so it's not apples to apples. Plus, White/Pomeranz would probably be contributors when Choo, Hafner, and Sizemore are all gone.

Not doing backflips over the trade but I'll wait to see what happens before judging it.

For once, it's nice to see us as buyers.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby bmonnig » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:32 pm

entertheshoe wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:
entertheshoe wrote:
dazindiansfanuk wrote:Heyman reporting it's now a 4-for-1 deal..... oh boy!


Maybe that 4th player is Orlando Cabrera. Or Chad Durbin. Or Frank Herrmann. Or Austin Kearns?


ha, we would need to make a 40-man roster move for him somehow so one of them would do that. Though think you're being a little too hopeful there :drinks:


Yea I was being uber sarcastic.

Looks like the trade is final.

Not sure what to think of it. Let's hope Ubaldo finds himself here, at least he's locked up until 2013, possibly 2014.

Not crazy about what we gave up, but I like how the front office just sent the message that we want to win NOW.


While that's a good message to send, I'd rather they be realistic about their chances of winning. Even with Jimenez, I don't think they're the favorite in the Central let alone a legit contender to win it all. I know anything can happen if you get in the playoffs but when it comes to possibly mortgaging a big part of the future, I want it to be with a world title in mind and not just possibly making the playoffs.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby OhioBaseball » Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:33 pm

If this trade is true, I'm sad to see Drew Pomeranz go b/c I've really liked him as a pitching prospect since I saw him as a sophomore in college. I loved the draft pick and still like him today; a 6'5" lefty with that arm slot that can throw fastballs consistently by good hitters is valuable. I like Alex White and was pleased with where Cleveland got him in the draft, but I've never seen him as an impact starting pitcher in the majors; more of a 3-4 guy, but that has its value for sure. Myself and my trusted cousin are also a bit concerned about his finger. White gets a lot of horizontal movement on his pitches and also throws a hard splitter -- he doesn't have the natural leverage that Pomeranz does. He may induce more stress on his finger to move the ball the way he does, and if he's got a recurring finger problem, that's no bueno b/c it's a fundamental thing that he relies upon to be good. Can't trade a guy just b/c of that (predicting injuries is extremely difficult), but it's something to pay attention to. Joe Gardner? I've been skeptical of him for a while now and have communicated that. His arm slot is bad and lefties kill him and always will unless he changes his delivery. Probably a middle relief guy, but could be a valuable situational guy down the road. Not much of a loss on Gardner.

Ubaldo has lost some off his fastball, but he's still averaging 94-95mph with good movement. He also had a torn finger nail early this year if I remember correctly, which attributed to his weak start.

I've seen it mentioned already, and deservedly so, that Jiminez is another 3 years vs. a total of 11 years of White and Pomeranz. The Indians are a cyclical team b/c of their status in the economics of MLB. I think with Cleveland's current talent, they look good for the 2012-2013 years (might get into the playoffs in 2011), but some key players will be gone after that and the team may be in a rebuilding phase come 2014 or 2015. The Indians need to optimize talent for when it is here, and Drew Pomeranz and Alex White may not be at their best in 2012-2013. I know Santana, Kipnis, Chisenhall and some others are under control for years to come, but I believe Asdrubal Cabrera, Justin Masterson and Shin-Soo Choo are all free agents after 2013 and probably aren't staying Indians beyond. Losing those guys will be a big hit to the team b/c they are arguably our best two position players and our best starting pitcher!

The Cleveland Indians years are 2012 and 2013 (and obviously 2011). It's not realistic to believe Drew Pomeranz and Alex White will be reaching their ceilings next year or the year after, so you're concentrating your talent toward 2011-2013 with this deal, which is probably the way you have to play it if you're Cleveland b/c this franchise is NOT a perennial powerhouse. I'm not saying 2014 is a lost cause, but Cleveland probably won't be as strong then b/c of the potential losses.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:00 pm

Disagree tribes yrs are 12-13. I see the point but it will likely take Kipnis and Chisenhall a cpl yrs to develop. Had tribe waited to develop Pomeranz and White... could lock up ACab long term and trade Choo away for ready players or two.

Tribe likely to acq. Ludwick tonight. Wish Iannetta was thrown in Jimenez deal for tribe at least.

Could see Tribe offer Fukudome arb. at a low amount let him walk and get comp pk. Tribe would also get comp pk for Ludwick and turn these pks into more ammo. Tribe spent more than I care for (prospects) but what's done is done. I like Jimenez but concerned about velo. Could be ??? a true Ace but comes with questions.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby A.Zajac » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:11 pm

Man do I have some mixed feelings on this deal... on one hand, man, are we giving up a lot. I don't mind losing White, but losing both White AND Pomeranz hurts. I could really careless about Gardner and McBride. However, with that said, I'm glad we're keeping Kipnis and Chisenhall. I'd rather keep those two.

I like Ubaldo and think he's a very good #1/2 pitcher. He strengthens our rotation even more, which is something else I really like. However, we still REALLY need a bat. You can have all of the best pitchers and if you don't score, you aren't going to win ballgames. And quite frankly, I'm not too thrilled with acquiring Ludwick. However, my thinking is that the Tribe brass wants to push for the playoffs this year, make a splash in the off season with maybe another bat (granted, we aren't going to go crazy), and then look to go deep in the playoffs in '12/'13. And this year's playoff ball would be great experience to a young team. But, that's just my opinion.

And this is a general rant to Cleveland fans.. not directed at anyone in particular... quit your damn complaining. Your damned if you do and damned if you don't. Tribe fans piss and moan when we get rid of our stars for "prospects". And now we piss and moan that we're getting rid of our prospects for a star (FOR ONCE!!!). Just enjoy the damn ride and be happy we're buyers for the first time in years. Good grief.

Interesting to also ask this... who becomes our number one prospect now, assuming Chisenhall and Kipnis don't qualify? Wolters? Lindor? Howard? Uhhhh..
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:16 pm

Guess the new FO strategy is being revealed. Draft high profile guys and turn them qkly into real big leaguers under team control. If wheels fall off tribe just sells Jimenez others. Now we see why the tribe has stocked up on pitching. Curious if Tribe is still in on Bourn.

Re: Acta's comments the other night... Right on.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:19 pm

A.Zajac wrote:Man do I have some mixed feelings on this deal... on one hand, man, are we giving up a lot. I don't mind losing White, but losing both White AND Pomeranz hurts. I could really careless about Gardner and McBride. However, with that said, I'm glad we're keeping Kipnis and Chisenhall. I'd rather keep those two.

I like Ubaldo and think he's a very good #1/2 pitcher. He strengthens our rotation even more, which is something else I really like. However, we still REALLY need a bat. You can have all of the best pitchers and if you don't score, you aren't going to win ballgames. And quite frankly, I'm not too thrilled with acquiring Ludwick. However, my thinking is that the Tribe brass wants to push for the playoffs this year, make a splash in the off season with maybe another bat (granted, we aren't going to go crazy), and then look to go deep in the playoffs in '12/'13. And this year's playoff ball would be great experience to a young team. But, that's just my opinion.

And this is a general rant to Cleveland fans.. not directed at anyone in particular... quit your damn complaining. Your damned if you do and damned if you don't. Tribe fans piss and moan when we get rid of our stars for "prospects". And now we piss and moan that we're getting rid of our prospects for a star (FOR ONCE!!!). Just enjoy the damn ride and be happy we're buyers for the first time in years. Good grief.

Interesting to also ask this... who becomes our number one prospect now, assuming Chisenhall and Kipnis don't qualify? Wolters? Lindor? Howard? Uhhhh..


So what you're SAYING is that the Tribe is going to sign Albert Pujols in the offseason. I like it.

:dirol: :dirol: :dirol: :dirol: :dirol:
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:22 pm

A.Zajac wrote:Interesting to also ask this... who becomes our number one prospect now, assuming Chisenhall and Kipnis don't qualify? Wolters? Lindor? Howard? Uhhhh..


IMO it's Lindor. Felt he would have been 2nd behind only Pom personally. Howard may be #2 now (assuming kip/chiz lose eligibility).
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby criznit2009 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:23 pm

A.Zajac wrote:Interesting to also ask this... who becomes our number one prospect now, assuming Chisenhall and Kipnis don't qualify? Wolters? Lindor? Howard? Uhhhh..


Good question but Aguilar and Chen keep moving on up....But Lindor I think. Howard prolly number 2.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby BrianM » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:26 pm

OhioBaseball wrote:If this trade is true, I'm sad to see Drew Pomeranz go b/c I've really liked him as a pitching prospect since I saw him as a sophomore in college. I loved the draft pick and still like him today; a 6'5" lefty with that arm slot that can throw fastballs consistently by good hitters is valuable. I like Alex White and was pleased with where Cleveland got him in the draft, but I've never seen him as an impact starting pitcher in the majors; more of a 3-4 guy, but that has its value for sure. Myself and my trusted cousin are also a bit concerned about his finger. White gets a lot of horizontal movement on his pitches and also throws a hard splitter -- he doesn't have the natural leverage that Pomeranz does. He may induce more stress on his finger to move the ball the way he does, and if he's got a recurring finger problem, that's no bueno b/c it's a fundamental thing that he relies upon to be good. Can't trade a guy just b/c of that (predicting injuries is extremely difficult), but it's something to pay attention to. Joe Gardner? I've been skeptical of him for a while now and have communicated that. His arm slot is bad and lefties kill him and always will unless he changes his delivery. Probably a middle relief guy, but could be a valuable situational guy down the road. Not much of a loss on Gardner.

Ubaldo has lost some off his fastball, but he's still averaging 94-95mph with good movement. He also had a torn finger nail early this year if I remember correctly, which attributed to his weak start.

I've seen it mentioned already, and deservedly so, that Jiminez is another 3 years vs. a total of 11 years of White and Pomeranz. The Indians are a cyclical team b/c of their status in the economics of MLB. I think with Cleveland's current talent, they look good for the 2012-2013 years (might get into the playoffs in 2011), but some key players will be gone after that and the team may be in a rebuilding phase come 2014 or 2015. The Indians need to optimize talent for when it is here, and Drew Pomeranz and Alex White may not be at their best in 2012-2013. I know Santana, Kipnis, Chisenhall and some others are under control for years to come, but I believe Asdrubal Cabrera, Justin Masterson and Shin-Soo Choo are all free agents after 2013 and probably aren't staying Indians beyond. Losing those guys will be a big hit to the team b/c they are arguably our best two position players and our best starting pitcher!

The Cleveland Indians years are 2012 and 2013 (and obviously 2011). It's not realistic to believe Drew Pomeranz and Alex White will be reaching their ceilings next year or the year after, so you're concentrating your talent toward 2011-2013 with this deal, which is probably the way you have to play it if you're Cleveland b/c this franchise is NOT a perennial powerhouse. I'm not saying 2014 is a lost cause, but Cleveland probably won't be as strong then b/c of the potential losses.


Absolutely Agree, very well said!

Our lineup looks very good when healthy, and this trade represents next year even more so than this year. I now expect us to add a MOR starter through free agency this winter and now I firmly believe that our management thinks our team can win RIGHT NOW.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby criznit2009 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:27 pm

On the other hand, losing Pomeranz hurts, but we still have Barnes who looks like a pretty good LH starter in his own right. Well we have him for now any way. And despite Packers "numbers" he still looks intriguing IMO. Looks like the tribe is setting its sights on 2012 for sure. Interested to see who the next indian is gonna be.... Drum roll please...
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:35 pm

Absolutely hate losing both Pomeranz and White. Like the add of Jimenez but hate that both had to be paired in the deal. One or the other, but both does hurt. Never know Jimenez could slot 1/2 with Masterson and flat out dominate. Will be fun to watch.

As Tony said makes signing Howard and Peters vital. I consider it likely, probably why Peters was in town early in the wk.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby JP_Frost » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:40 pm

The thing that worries me most is Jimenez' drop in velocity. His secondary numbers are still very strong, but I also read some reports that Rockies were hesitant about a physical and the fact that they let him make his start is a bit strange (especially since he was ineffective, though that could be the nerves about the unknown).
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:47 pm

@Jp actually was listening to Rox game to hear what they had to say about it. It was clearly nerves that caused Jimenez to be awful. Walked like 5 guys and gave up a bad stolen base too. They did mention he had habit at times of getting into trouble early and then pitching better as game went on.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby A.Zajac » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:51 pm

The one thing lost in this is also Huff is the odd man out and will head back to CBus, which is a shame because he was pitching really well.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby A.Zajac » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:51 pm

Orlando Cabrera has been traded to the Giants. Thank God!
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby JP_Frost » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:53 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:@Jp actually was listening to Rox game to hear what they had to say about it. It was clearly nerves that caused Jimenez to be awful. Walked like 5 guys and gave up a bad stolen base too. They did mention he had habit at times of getting into trouble early and then pitching better as game went on.


Could very well be and I believe Jimenez confirmed the nerves. It's still strange to have your guy going out there knowing a deal is pretty much done. Right now it's pending Jimenez' physical, so if he's acquired we must assume all is well, but the whole thing hasn't been all that smooth imo.

I hope Antonetti got pissed by the Rockies starting Ubaldo and demands for Ianetta to be included.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:54 pm

Jimenez's last 10 starts;

DATE OPP W-L SV ER H BB IP SO
6/12/11 LAD 0-1 0 2 11 1 5.1 2
6/18/11 DET 1-0 0 3 8 2 5.0 5
6/24/11 @NYY 1-0 0 2 4 4 7.0 7
6/29/11 CWS 0-0 0 2 4 2 7.0 4
7/4/11 @ATL 0-1 0 3 6 1 5.1 9
7/9/11 @WSH 1-0 0 1 5 1 8.0 8
7/14/11 MIL 1-0 0 2 6 2 6.0 4
7/19/11 ATL 1-0 0 2 7 2 6.2 9
7/24/11 @ARI 0-1 0 5 8 2 5.0 8
7/30/11 SD 0-0 0 4 4 1.0 2
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:58 pm

Mlbtraderumors reports OCab to Giants.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby JP_Frost » Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:59 pm

homerawayfromhome wrote:Mlbtraderumors reports OCab to Giants.


Addition by subtraction
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby jellis » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:02 pm

JP_Frost wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:Mlbtraderumors reports OCab to Giants.


Addition by subtraction


More than that we got Thomas Neal
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby A.Zajac » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:03 pm

jellis wrote:
JP_Frost wrote:
homerawayfromhome wrote:Mlbtraderumors reports OCab to Giants.


Addition by subtraction


More than that we got Thomas Neal


Neal hit .295 w/ 2 HR and 25 RBI in 60 games in AAA.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:05 pm

Wow, we got Thomas Neal for Orlando Cabrera.

I totally called this trade a long time ago when looking for someone to get for Orlando Cabrera. RH OF bat, 23 years old, was ranked the 6th best prospect in their system in the MLB.com preseason rankings. Crazy. I totally called the Browns trading for Bunkley today too, dang I'm good!

:dirol:
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby jellis » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:08 pm

entertheshoe wrote:Wow, we got Thomas Neal for Orlando Cabrera.

I totally called this trade a long time ago when looking for someone to get for Orlando Cabrera. RH OF bat, 23 years old, was ranked the 6th best prospect in their system in the MLB.com preseason rankings. Crazy. I totally called the Browns trading for Bunkley today too, dang I'm good!

:dirol:


Two just awesome trades on all levels in my view
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby criznit2009 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:09 pm

Jason Donald time finally??? If so talk about a long battle back! An upgrade over Ocab I do believe.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby entertheshoe » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:10 pm

http://indiansprospectinsider.prophpbb.com/topic1149.html

AND I QUOTE!:

"I wonder if combining O Cabrera and Lou Marson could get us someone like RF Thomas Neal. He's ranked as their 7th best prospect according to MLB.com and is 23 years old (turns 24 in August) yet still in AAA. Nothing spectacular but he has good size, is a right handed bat who hits lefties well (333/390/426). Giants ML OFers as it is are R Pat Burrell (free agent 2012), R Cody Ross, R Aaron Rowand (extremely overpaid but is in their books until 2013), and S Andres Torres, not to mention their highest prospect Brandon Belt plays both OF and 1B. So there might not be room for Neal, making him expendable.

Probably will never happen but hey it's fun thinking about."

*Pats self on the back* didn't even have to give up Marson either...
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:11 pm

Agreed.

Looking over my rankings for the top prospects tribe trades 1, 2 and 30 White, Pomeranz and Gardner.
My new number one not including players unsigned reranking them and dropping players who graduate.
1) Tony Wolters. I wasn't a big lover of this kid. Not a hater either, but this kid has impressed Tribe will be loaded up the middle if Lindor signs.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby Chip Davis » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:12 pm

I like trading away OCab better than trading for Ubaldo. :good:
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby JP_Frost » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:13 pm

Neal is an interesting prospect. He hit for alot of power in 09, but never really showed that pop again. If he could somehow regain some that, he's definately a guy to keep an eye on.

Getting him for Oldman Cabrera is a steal!
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby ChadS17 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:14 pm

A.Zajac wrote:The one thing lost in this is also Huff is the odd man out and will head back to CBus, which is a shame because he was pitching really well.


Personally was thinking and hoping Carrasco is sent out for the time being for a slap in the pants and more time to evaluate Carmona.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby GeronimoSon » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:15 pm

entertheshoe wrote:http://indiansprospectinsider.prophpbb.com/topic1149.html

AND I QUOTE!:

"I wonder if combining O Cabrera and Lou Marson could get us someone like RF Thomas Neal. He's ranked as their 7th best prospect according to MLB.com and is 23 years old (turns 24 in August) yet still in AAA. Nothing spectacular but he has good size, is a right handed bat who hits lefties well (333/390/426). Giants ML OFers as it is are R Pat Burrell (free agent 2012), R Cody Ross, R Aaron Rowand (extremely overpaid but is in their books until 2013), and S Andres Torres, not to mention their highest prospect Brandon Belt plays both OF and 1B. So there might not be room for Neal, making him expendable.

Probably will never happen but hey it's fun thinking about."

*Pats self on the back* didn't even have to give up Marson either...
Kudos to the insight.. great call...

Do you have some lotto numbers you can share?.. PM Me & we'll split it...
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby stoike » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:18 pm

ChadS17 wrote:
A.Zajac wrote:The one thing lost in this is also Huff is the odd man out and will head back to CBus, which is a shame because he was pitching really well.


Personally was thinking and hoping Carrasco is sent out for the time being for a slap in the pants and more time to evaluate Carmona.


NO WAY is Carrasco going anywhere. He has been streaky as hell, but he has the 2nd best ceiling on the starting staff. Easily.
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby homerawayfromhome » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:19 pm

Ubaldo Jimenez
#38 | P | Active
SummaryStatsFantasy News
Full Name Ubaldo Jimenez
Born January 22, 1984
Birthplace Nagua, Dominican Republic
Height 6'4" Weight 210lbs
Bats R Throws R
College ---
MLB Debut September 26, 2006
Regular Season
TM W-L ERA SV G IP SO
2011 COL 6-9 4.20 0 20 122.0 116
Career 56-45 3.62 0 137 850.0 771
Splits
Away Games: 2.83 Current Month: 3.77
Day Games: 5.93 Home Games: 5.55
Last 30 Days: 4.78 Night Games: 3.23
On Grass: 4.20 vs Left: .240
vs Right: .258
Last 3 Seasons
TM W-L ERA SV G IP SO
2010 COL 19-8 2.88 0 33 221.2 214
2009 COL 15-12 3.47 0 33 218.0 198
2008 COL 12-12 3.99 0 34 198.2 172
Full Career
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby jellis » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:25 pm

So the Browns have to keep up with the Indians and also made their second trade of the day that amused me
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Re: Improvements in many areas but we still need ...

Postby Edible14 » Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:26 pm

stoike wrote:NO WAY is Carrasco going anywhere. He has been streaky as hell, but he has the 2nd best ceiling on the starting staff. Easily.


Well... whether or not he'll be useful (or more useful than Huff) for this team down the stretch is not a question that we can answer. We all know the stuff is there and that he can use it if he keeps his head straight. That's something that Acta and Belcher have to figure out.

In other news... A rotation of Jimenez/Masterson/Tomlin/Carrasco/Carmona... :s_omg

This team will come around on offense. Especially if Neal is our 4th OF until Choo and Sizemore come back, hitting against lefties (DFA Kearns to make room for Jimenez?). Chis and Kipnis are going to get better as time goes on. Donald will be an upgrade over OCab. And Choo and Sizemore should help out a lot when they get back.

These moves might get us into the world series. I'm not kidding.
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