MLB Hot Stove

[ironmike]

Geronimo, if the Indians could get Franklin G. back it would be a good move for many reasons. Right now, our outfield depth is not good at all. One guy goes down or has a bad year we have no players on the horizon who could fill in. He brings speed, defense intangibles and should be at the point in his career he gets it all together. The one thing I remember most about Guiterrez is he hit good pitching. He should have never been let go for Joe Smith, not a good trade.

Signing Myers was good, getting a healthy Marcum would stablize the pitching staff and raise eyebrows with our division rivals. Marcum puts the Indians into a contending category.

With Marson, Stubbs and Reynolds we have three guys capable of hitting .220 which suffocates any teams ability to score runs. We gave up as a team last year 845 runs we need to score that many. Adding FG would aid our ability to score more runs versus a Tim Fedroff / Thomas Neal type.

Back to Franklin G., when Shapiro traded him, the Indians did not have at the time or were ever able to get a RH replacement the loss of FG. That move led to 2 years of an unbalanced line up which is only now being corrected.

After Swisher, we still needed two more professional hitters. Getting Stubbs could fill one of those voids. Frankie G., would be excellent and fill a huge gap in our line up. The four outfielders would get enough AB's because they could be rotated in the DH role. We needed two more starting pitchers, Myers is a genuine prick, a real gamer, he'll knock people down, change speeds, win games, compete and be a team leader. He fills one of our starting pitching voids. Now, they get a guy like Marcum (healthy) or Lohse or trade for a good starting pitcher and they can contend. Hoping they finish the job

The new approach every year must be, go into each season assembling a team capable of winning the division, forget the rebuilding crap. So far they are on the right path but more work to do, let's hope they do it. Kind of believe they will.

EOM

[homerawayfromhome]

The Rangers have reportedly signed yet another bullpen arm in Jason Fraser for $1.5 M. Solid deal for the Rangers if Fraser is healthy. Further lengthens their pen depth too.

[GoTribe028]

Well the Nick Swisher signing is now officially official, having a press conference at 4 on STO.

Wonder how long til we hear that Russ Canzler was DFA'd

[A.Zajac]

Listening to Keith Law podcast... Indians highlights:

- Loved the Bauer deal. Thinks he still has ace stuff. Trade made all the sense in the world.
- Thinks Indians could flip Swisher next offseason for more long term young talent. Makes sense in the short term, may help win a game or two now. Later in the deal basically said it's stupid.
- Hates the Myers deal. He said, and I quote, "He's just a bad." Goes on to say he's a terrible human being. There's a line drawn in the sand and Myers is a joke and makes no sense for a GM to go after a guy like him. Points to beating his wife in public, the locker room incident, etc.

[GoTribe028]

Listening to Keith Law podcast... Indians highlights:

- Loved the Bauer deal. Thinks he still has ace stuff. Trade made all the sense in the world.
- Thinks Indians could flip Swisher next offseason for more long term young talent. Makes sense in the short term, may help win a game or two now. Later in the deal basically said it's stupid.
- Hates the Myers deal. He said, and I quote, "He's just a bad." Goes on to say he's a terrible human being. There's a line drawn in the sand and Myers is a joke and makes no sense for a GM to go after a guy like him. Points to beating his wife in public, the locker room incident, etc.

I'm not a fan of Law, but I agree that all of the Indians signings are basically another avenue for acquiring tradable assets for a later time if need be. Not sure how quickly the Indians would consider flipping him but we will see.

I don't get all this stuff on Myers. Yes, I get it, he punched his wife, charges that were later dropped if that matters. He is also not the first player to call out a reporter for whatever reason and his tussle with Cole Hammels isn't the first time that's ever happened in a clubhouse.

Honest question here...other than his time in Phillie, has Myers had any kind of altercations?

[GeronimoSon]

028.. nope.. The label is semi-permanent and something he gets to live with..not that it's any bit of Keith Law's business. I'm sure there will be plenty of space for the protesters to hold signs and show their displeasure for domestic battery incidents from years ago.. They'll be the ones next to the three people wearing Indians headdresses and carrying signs illustrating the denigration of Native Americans.. Altogether, seven or eight people will have something meaningful to them to do that day...

RustyMike.. yes.. Franky G is the goods. While I don't know about the right handed imbalance time frame, it was clearly a trade that hasn't worked for the Mariners. With Franky G's defense alone, he'd be a +1 to 1.5 WAR player. He's hitting the HELL out of the ball in Venezuela this off season as he's finally healthy. He'd look great again with Chief Wahoo on his sleeve patrolling RF. Swisher can handle 1B where his defense is a plus with off days going to Reynolds. NO MORE OF THIS CARLOS SANTANA HYBRID 1B/C nonsense.. He's a catcher.. keep him there where he can be a plus offensive player.. Franky G could have an a career/breakout season like Rios did for the CWSox last season..

One pseudo-exceptional SP with Franky G.. "and these guys won't look so fawking bad..." They could be in contention !!

[dazindiansfanuk]

Thomas Neal DFA'd for Swisher, leading to a quite brilliant journalistic cock-up from MLBTR

Neal, who is the son of Giants skipper Bruce Bochy, spent the 2012 season with Double-A Akron and posted a .314/.400/.467 slash line in 470 plate appearances. He also spent nine games on the Tribe's varsity squad last year.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/01/i ... nment.html

[dazindiansfanuk]

A couple of videos of the Swisher presser and post-presser interview.... the guy's like a kid with that smile on his face!

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?conte ... 6&c_id=cle

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?conte ... 6&c_id=cle

[homerawayfromhome]

028.. nope.. The label is semi-permanent and something he gets to live with..not that it's any bit of Keith Law's business. I'm sure there will be plenty of space for the protesters to hold signs and show their displeasure for domestic battery incidents from years ago.. They'll be the ones next to the three people wearing Indians headdresses and carrying signs illustrating the denigration of Native Americans.. Altogether, seven or eight people will have something meaningful to them to do that day...

RustyMike.. yes.. Franky G is the goods. While I don't know about the right handed imbalance time frame, it was clearly a trade that hasn't worked for the Mariners. With Franky G's defense alone, he'd be a +1 to 1.5 WAR player. He's hitting the HELL out of the ball in Venezuela this off season as he's finally healthy. He'd look great again with Chief Wahoo on his sleeve patrolling RF. Swisher can handle 1B where his defense is a plus with off days going to Reynolds. NO MORE OF THIS CARLOS SANTANA HYBRID 1B/C nonsense.. He's a catcher.. keep him there where he can be a plus offensive player.. Franky G could have an a career/breakout season like Rios did for the CWSox last season..

One pseudo-exceptional SP with Franky G.. "and these guys won't look so fawking bad..." They could be in contention !!

I find it extremely annoying all the people who call for the Indians to change their name, etc.

My wife is a Native American, she actually likes it that they are named after Indians as do many of people I've met from her Tribe.

[daingean]

028.. nope.. The label is semi-permanent and something he gets to live with..not that it's any bit of Keith Law's business. I'm sure there will be plenty of space for the protesters to hold signs and show their displeasure for domestic battery incidents from years ago.. They'll be the ones next to the three people wearing Indians headdresses and carrying signs illustrating the denigration of Native Americans.. Altogether, seven or eight people will have something meaningful to them to do that day...

RustyMike.. yes.. Franky G is the goods. While I don't know about the right handed imbalance time frame, it was clearly a trade that hasn't worked for the Mariners. With Franky G's defense alone, he'd be a +1 to 1.5 WAR player. He's hitting the HELL out of the ball in Venezuela this off season as he's finally healthy. He'd look great again with Chief Wahoo on his sleeve patrolling RF. Swisher can handle 1B where his defense is a plus with off days going to Reynolds. NO MORE OF THIS CARLOS SANTANA HYBRID 1B/C nonsense.. He's a catcher.. keep him there where he can be a plus offensive player.. Franky G could have an a career/breakout season like Rios did for the CWSox last season..

One pseudo-exceptional SP with Franky G.. "and these guys won't look so fawking bad..." They could be in contention !!

I find it extremely annoying all the people who call for the Indians to change their name, etc.

My wife is a Native American, she actually likes it that they are named after Indians as do many of people I've met from her Tribe.

I'm not Native American but wasn't the team named to honor Louis Sockalexis (the first NA to play in the MLB)? I can see being offended by the Redskins as that is a real slur. I do think they are more up in arms by the Chief Wahoo caricature. BTW, the Braves are bringing back their Indian head logo.

Still think the Indians need a lefty in the BP (and starting rotation if they can) plus a nice bench bat corner OF. Carrera will be 1 reserve (imo) and he'll add speed to the bench. For the BP, hopefully Kazmir, Barnes and Hagadone can step up and hold down 2 spots but we have a deep BP (Perez, Pestano, Albers, Shaw, Smith, Allen) so we don't particularly have a lot of room w/o making a move but from a match up situation we do need some lefties.

[GeronimoSon]

..I'm not Native American but wasn't the team named to honor Louis Sockalexis (the first NA to play in the MLB)?...

Seems to me, the Louis Soxalexis story has been going around for years and years.. He was a pioneer as a native american to be a major leaguer, but, I don't believe he was the first. He definitely was one of the first handful, though. The naming of the Indians, from some of the history, says it was in honor of the Penobscott Indian tribe that Louis Soxalexis was from. It was a name selected via the newspaper at the time that seemed to make sense for both the club (who were called the spiders and naps until the st louis split) & the fans. So, it was an honorable naming. The original Indian logo was a caricature that was somewhat sullen. That evolved to the current Chief Wahoo we know today.

As far as lefties in the pen go, two is usually just enough. One is too few. Barnes, Hagadone Huff and Kazmir (all former starters, btw) should be more than adequate to fill the role. As far as RHRP's go, the names listed as candidates for the pen this year needs to be amended to include Trey Haley.. WOW ! is he coming on like a freight train..

[daingean]

As far as lefties in the pen go, two is usually just enough. One is too few. Barnes, Hagadone Huff and Kazmir (all former starters, btw) should be more than adequate to fill the role. As far as RHRP's go, the names listed as candidates for the pen this year needs to be amended to include Trey Haley.. WOW ! is he coming on like a freight train..

I do consider Haley an option but I think he won't be a legit option until June and more probably July time frame. I think he needs more seasoning and with the luxury of 8-9 BP arms ready, I don't think he will be rushed. I am not sure on Huff as unless he wins a SP slot, I don't see him being 1 of the top 6/7 BP arms despite throwing from the left side.

[Prosecutor]

Frankie G? We already have an offensively challenged but excellent defensive center fielder who hits right-handed. In fact, we have two guys who can play center well.

Seattle is the perfect team for Franklin because the huge outfield requires a center fielder with speed and a strong throwing arm. In smaller ballparks his defense isn't as much of an asset and his lack of offense becomes a bigger issue.

What do the Mariners have as far as starting pitching prospects they could give us for Asdrubal? That's what I'm looking for in any deal with the M's, or anybody else for that matter.

[ironmike]

Prosecutor agree, we need starting pitching as the top priority, but remain extremely thin as far as OF depth with ML experience. Frankie G., would not be a centerpiece of any trade this team needs to make to upgrade the starting pitching in order to complete the much needed overhaul this winter. How often can any team go through an entire season with just 3 OF's and one of them can't hit his weight? Besides, Swisher can play a little 1B and a player like Guiterrez can play RF with the best of them. It provides lots of flexibility between the DH, OF and 1B. With lousy starting pitching defense is important too.

IF the Indians do not have any more dollars for free agency then they are going to be forced to trade an established front line talent in order to acquire the starting pitcher. If they don't fix the starting pitching they will not make up ground with their division competitors.

Which of our players can we replace internally that has real value to other teams covet that could bring a good starting pitcher in return? All points to either Perez or Cabrera. Any others?

There are still starting pitchers out there available who could help the rotation other than free agents.

What are the chances the Indians trade either Perez and or Cabrerea prior to spring training?

[GeronimoSon]

Frankie G? We already have an offensively challenged but excellent defensive center fielder who hits right-handed. In fact, we have two guys who can play center well.

Seattle is the perfect team for Franklin because the huge outfield requires a center fielder with speed and a strong throwing arm. In smaller ballparks his defense isn't as much of an asset and his lack of offense becomes a bigger issue.

What do the Mariners have as far as starting pitching prospects they could give us for Asdrubal? That's what I'm looking for in any deal with the M's, or anybody else for that matter.

Pros.. what I'm looking at is KEEPING both Cabrera and CPerez. The offensively challenged comment is fair, regarding Franklin Gutierrez, however, there has been some mitigating circumstances that didn't allow him to be on the field. A foot / nerve disorder (plantar fasciitis) and a pulled muscle in his torso hampered his ability to play (i.e. he couldn't run or swing.. necessary things to play baseball). He is now fully 100% healthy and just crushing the ball in the VWL.. He's a superb defender and would play RF, primarily. This would permit Swisher to see more time at 1B where he's best suited... Mark Reynolds would continue as a DH/1B/LF/3B... all good things.. The deal I have in mind with the Mariners involves doing what the Reds did with the Indians as far as the cash used in the Choo deal, only in reverse. The trade also exploits the area of strength for the Indians:

Mariners get Francisco Lindor and Cody Allen
Indians get Justin Smoak, Franklin Gutierrez (& $$$) and Brandon Maurer

The Mariners then use Lindor and Allen as two pieces/prospects to acquire Giancarlo Stanton from the Marlins..

Thoughts?

[homerawayfromhome]

Ironmike,

I'd think there's a better chance that Perez or one of the relievers is traded prior to spring training. Fact is I think we all can say we know the Tribe will try to acq. a LHRP. The question is who? JP Howell and Manny Parra are both FA, I'd expect Howell could get overpaid, and Parra gets K's but also posts an ugly ERA. I'd expect the Tribe to make a deal for a LHRP, I've mentioned the Phillies, Giants, Mariners and A's as teams with depth and I'm sure there are others...I haven't viewed every roster.

[GoTribe028]

Frankie G? We already have an offensively challenged but excellent defensive center fielder who hits right-handed. In fact, we have two guys who can play center well.

Seattle is the perfect team for Franklin because the huge outfield requires a center fielder with speed and a strong throwing arm. In smaller ballparks his defense isn't as much of an asset and his lack of offense becomes a bigger issue.

What do the Mariners have as far as starting pitching prospects they could give us for Asdrubal? That's what I'm looking for in any deal with the M's, or anybody else for that matter.

Pros.. what I'm looking at is KEEPING both Cabrera and CPerez. The offensively challenged comment is fair, regarding Franklin Gutierrez, however, there has been some mitigating circumstances that didn't allow him to be on the field. A foot / nerve disorder (plantar fasciitis) and a pulled muscle in his torso hampered his ability to play (i.e. he couldn't run or swing.. necessary things to play baseball). He is now fully 100% healthy and just crushing the ball in the VWL.. He's a superb defender and would play RF, primarily. This would permit Swisher to see more time at 1B where he's best suited... Mark Reynolds would continue as a DH/1B/LF/3B... all good things.. The deal I have in mind with the Mariners involves doing what the Reds did with the Indians as far as the cash used in the Choo deal, only in reverse. The trade also exploits the area of strength for the Indians:

Mariners get Francisco Lindor and Cody Allen
Indians get Justin Smoak, Franklin Gutierrez (& $$$) and Brandon Maurer

The Mariners then use Lindor and Allen as two pieces/prospects to acquire Giancarlo Stanton from the Marlins..

Thoughts?

Reynolds anywhere but DH/1B is a mistake.

Idnrather have Lindor. & Allen if all the deal nets beyond Maurer is Smoak & Gutierrez. Awful deal for Cleveland IMO.

[homerawayfromhome]

Personally, I'd like to see the Tribe make a deal for a young OF who could man RF for the foreseeable future. I think at some point they will address bringing in another OF or two and it's probably safe to say they will bring in one or two more on minor league deals with spring invites. A few I'd like to see brought in on minors deals...Ryan Raburn, Ryan Sweeney.

IF at some point in the future the Cards and Indians come together on a deal for ACab, I'd love to see the Tribe land Oscar Tavares. I really like Lance Lynn too, big durable guy and a hard thrower. He's probably a number 3 but I think he could become a 2 with some more maturity on the mound.

Here's some other young OF that could be "targets"...
Jackie Bradley - Red Sox
Bryce Brentz - Red Sox
Mason Williams - Yanks
Tyler Austin - Yanks
Kole Calhoun - Angels
Leon Landry - Mariners
Francisco Martinez - Mariners
Michael Choice - A's
Drew Vettleson - Rays
Joc Pederson - Dodgers
Rymer Liriano - Padres
Edison Rincon - Padres
Gary Brown - Giants
Josh Bell - Pirates

Some of these OF are MLB ready, others not so close...IMO, Tavares is most likely the STAR of the bunch.

[GoTribe028]

Ironmike,

I'd think there's a better chance that Perez or one of the relievers is traded prior to spring training. Fact is I think we all can say we know the Tribe will try to acq. a LHRP. The question is who? JP Howell and Manny Parra are both FA, I'd expect Howell could get overpaid, and Parra gets K's but also posts an ugly ERA. I'd expect the Tribe to make a deal for a LHRP, I've mentioned the Phillies, Giants, Mariners and A's as teams with depth and I'm sure there are others...I haven't viewed every roster.

Perez simply isn't getting moved this offseason. Closers still out there are getting close to just settling on one year deals. Don't be shocked if Detroit or the Dodgers nabs either Rafael Soriano or Brian Wilson on a 1 year deal.

Could see a team having interest in almost any of our other current relievers, but I fully expect CPerez WILL be an Indians at least until the deadline in 2013.

Franklu, I want JP Howell. He's the goods, but you can only spend so much for a reliever. I'm shocked he's not been nabbed yet to be honest. Parra could slip through close enough to spring training to get decent value on, just won't get the kind of results Howell can get you.

[GoTribe028]

Personally, I'd like to see the Tribe make a deal for a young OF who could man RF for the foreseeable future. I think at some point they will address bringing in another OF or two and it's probably safe to say they will bring in one or two more on minor league deals with spring invites. A few I'd like to see brought in on minors deals...Ryan Raburn, Ryan Sweeney.

If they're minor league deals both Rayburn and Sweeney would be solid pick ups. Give them out clauses if they're not on the roster by a certain point in the season if you want, there's simply no risk in those types of pickups.

[homerawayfromhome]

Ironmike,

I'd think there's a better chance that Perez or one of the relievers is traded prior to spring training. Fact is I think we all can say we know the Tribe will try to acq. a LHRP. The question is who? JP Howell and Manny Parra are both FA, I'd expect Howell could get overpaid, and Parra gets K's but also posts an ugly ERA. I'd expect the Tribe to make a deal for a LHRP, I've mentioned the Phillies, Giants, Mariners and A's as teams with depth and I'm sure there are others...I haven't viewed every roster.

Perez simply isn't getting moved this offseason. Closers still out there are getting close to just settling on one year deals. Don't be shocked if Detroit or the Dodgers nabs either Rafael Soriano or Brian Wilson on a 1 year deal.

Could see a team having interest in almost any of our other current relievers, but I fully expect CPerez WILL be an Indians at least until the deadline in 2013.

Franklu, I want JP Howell. He's the goods, but you can only spend so much for a reliever. I'm shocked he's not been nabbed yet to be honest. Parra could slip through close enough to spring training to get decent value on, just won't get the kind of results Howell can get you.

GoTribe,

I agree Chris Perez likely, isn't getting moved. I would think he's probably more likely to get moved than ACab at this point. But I FULLY EXPECT THAT BOTH COULD BE TRADED BY THE TRADE DEADLINE. Right now, I think they take both into the season and play things out. At some point they will have to look to the future on both of these guys and frankly, I don't see them extending either contract.

[daingean]

Perez simply isn't getting moved this offseason. Closers still out there are getting close to just settling on one year deals. Don't be shocked if Detroit or the Dodgers nabs either Rafael Soriano or Brian Wilson on a 1 year deal.

Soriano will require draft pick compensation which will make it difficult for someone to sign him to a 1 year deal while still offering closer money. He'll eventually sign but.....it will be after teams explore other options. Wilson after not pitching much the last 2 seasons, will not be signed as an end-all but as a flyer (hoping to catch lightning in a bottle).

In the end, I think you are correct that CPerez will be around......but I'm only 75% on that.....so I'd say 25% chance he gets traded.

[GeronimoSon]

Interesting comment at a Fangraphs Prospect Chat (Mike Newman, presiding):

12:26 Comment From Tiger: How would you rate the following in order? Hultzen, Gausman, Bauer, Zunino and Bogaerts.
12:27 Mike Newman: Give me Bogaerts, Zunino and then throw the pitchers in a hat and select at random.

I don't know who "tiger" is, but it's interesting to note the pitcher evaluation given. I would have put Hultzen at the head this list...

[GoTribe028]

Word is Brett Myers has passed his physical with the Indians

[homerawayfromhome]

Per: Mlbtraderumors.com Myers 2014 option is for $8M.

[GoTribe028]

Yankees have claimed the one and only Russel Canzler off waivers from the Indians

[homerawayfromhome]

Canzler, we hardly knew you...

[homerawayfromhome]

Any word of Jeanmar Gomez being claimed? He still has about a week to go before he offically clears waivers, and could be sent down or traded.

[GoTribe028]

Canzler, we hardly knew you...

I think it's pretty telling that McDade and McGuinness have been kept over him. They are both reportedly average to above average on the field so perhaps the Indians see value in them since they can both DH and not hurt you when you play them in the field?

Or it's just a cruel joke on Canzler...

[GoTribe028]

Any word of Jeanmar Gomez being claimed? He still has about a week to go before he offically clears waivers, and could be sent down or traded.

If he clears waivers then the Indians can outright him to the minors since this is first time being DFA'd.

[Edible14]

The larger part of the discussion was utilizing these "extra parts" in correlation with someone of use to fill a need or acquire something of use for the Tribe. A pkg deal that of clears a spot for the Tribe.

Right, but anything "of use" for the tribe (we need a LHRP, Corner utility guy and a good starter) is going to cost above whatever fringe guys we have on the 40. It's not a matching situation, especially at a time when pretty much every team is feeling the 40 man roster crunch. As much as I'd love to see Phelps and Albers packaged up for someone useful, I don't think there's a team out there that's looking for that sort of deal right now. I keep trying to think of places that might, theoretically at least, want Phelps. I think the Royals and Cardinals both might be a fit given their poor options at the big league level. Considering that Phelps is behind both Kipnis and Aviles right now, I would think it would be best for all parties if the Indians found something else for him.

Surprised the Yankees picked up Canzler. Seems to me that their 40 was relatively full, but ultimately I fully expect him to be DFA'd as soon as the Yankees make a pickup. Seems a bit like the De La Cruz situation last year, where everyone is just trying to claim him so that they can DFA him later and be the team that gets to keep him without having him on the 40.

[homerawayfromhome]

Here's a pretty good run down of the Indians bullpen...
http://wahoosonfirst.com/2013/01/03/pro ... 3-bullpen/

At some point I think they have to consider trading a RH arm. Personally, Id like to see them try to extend Joe Smith for another yr or two (option) beyond 2013. Considering that the Tribe has yet to add another LHRP to the mix, it could take a cpl minor moves to clear a spot.

[homerawayfromhome]

The larger part of the discussion was utilizing these "extra parts" in correlation with someone of use to fill a need or acquire something of use for the Tribe. A pkg deal that of clears a spot for the Tribe.

Right, but anything "of use" for the tribe (we need a LHRP, Corner utility guy and a good starter) is going to cost above whatever fringe guys we have on the 40. It's not a matching situation, especially at a time when pretty much every team is feeling the 40 man roster crunch. As much as I'd love to see Phelps and Albers packaged up for someone useful, I don't think there's a team out there that's looking for that sort of deal right now.

Surprised the Yankees picked up Canzler. Seems to me that their 40 was relatively full, but ultimately I fully expect him to be DFA'd as soon as the Yankees make a pickup. Seems a bit like the De La Cruz situation last year, where everyone is just trying to claim him so that they can DFA him later and be the team that gets to keep him without having him on the 40.

Agreed on Canzler, I think that was the idea entirely with him.

As for packaging the "extra parts" it would be difficult and would likely be a give-a-way of sorts. Although I wouldn't rule out something like Albers and Diaz / Phelps to a team like the Mets which is looking for bullpen help and middle of the infield help.

[homerawayfromhome]

Here's an outside the box thought...

Could the Tribe sign Kyle Lohse to a deal similar to Brett Myers 1 yr / $7 M?

Here's the deeper thought behind this...the Tribe could provide a number of incentives such as IP, ERA, AS game app., GS to total his deal up to about $10. Here's the clincher for the deal...add in a clause that guarantees Lohse that they will not offer him a qualifying offer. The Tribe could even tempt Lohse further with a mutual option for 2 yrs / $28 M. In essence it would equal potentially a 3 yr deal for $35 M and potentially $3 M in incentives.

The breakdown...
1 yr / $7 M w/ $3 M in incentives & a non-qualifying offer guarantee after '13 and a mutual option for 2 yrs / $28 M.

The Tribe would lose their 3rd rd pk this yr for one of the most talented SP in FA. If the Tribe were to contend they could simply keep him and play out the season with him. OR...as the July 31st trade deadline looms, the Tribe could look to move Lohse for a cpl of young high upside prospects (B+) in return.

I know something like this will probably never happen, but WHAT IF CA decided to make another bold / aggressive & creative move?

Comments???

[GeronimoSon]

Well, homer.. this idea is creative, I'll give you that... and sure, there is an ever so small likelihood of a repeat situation with another Boras Client, Ryan Madson, who ended up with a one year deal with the Reds AFTER he "had" a deal to stay with the Phillies (4 yrs/$ 44MM)..that was rescinded or didn't get signed.. or something. It was REALLY shady.. Boras and Madsen were still shopping 'services" and they still had the Phillies contract in his back pocket.. I don't recall the exact details other than it ended up as a less than friendly/ethical tet^a^tet in the media between Scott Boras and Reuben Amaro. When both sides are yelling, you know both sides had their share of culpability. Yeah.. I know, big surprise with an agent.. but I digress..

Couple of questions.. If you were Lohse & security is the issue, wouldn't you want a player option, not a mutual option contract?. Also, from Lohse's perspective, wouldn't he also want a NTC or some control in that regard.. I mean, he really doesn't want to be at the whim of 'Trade-slinger' Antonetti, does he?.. (injecting a sense of drama into a caricature "illustrating" the new direction of the Indians ?)

Bottom line... Boras isn't desperate enough at this time to 'settle' for a one year deal. I'm afraid that if it was a one year deal, it would have to be for major cash.. cash the Indians do not want to or have to spend according to Jordan Bastian's Tweet from yesterday...

Then again.. perhaps a trade of one of the three chips..or San Diego's GM has a brain-fart and trades for Ubaldo?.. that could free up the resources to make just "sutcha deal!!"

[homerawayfromhome]

A few minor notes...

Teams with 40 - man roster space:

Braves 38
Rockies 39
Dodgers 39
Mets 38
Phillies 39
Giants 38
Jays 39
Nationals 38

Teams who are full, with a signing pending:

Red Sox (Napoli)
Cubs (Villanueva)
Pirates (Liriano)

[homerawayfromhome]

LHRP JP Howell is reportedly close to a 1 yr deal with the Dodgers.

[Prosecutor]

Could the Tribe sign Kyle Lohse to a deal similar to Brett Myers 1 yr / $7 M?

Lohse is 30-11 over the last two years with ERA's of 3.39 (2011) and 2.86 (2012). Why would he sign a one-year deal for $7 million plus incentives? That's a contract for pitchers that, well, suck. Or have been good in the past but are coming off a serious injury and can't get a multi-year deal until they prove they're healthy.

And he'd come to Cleveland for that deal? Or anywhere?

[homerawayfromhome]

Prosecutor,

You only quoted a small fragment... That was the catcher, with the presupposition that Lohse would recieve a guarantee to enter FA again w/o being tied to a qualifying offer. That's HUGE... The post also included $3 M in incentives and the potential for 2 yrs / $28 M more in the form of a mutual option. Lohse would come at the cost of a third rd pk. At that point it's much cheaper than any other team would have to give.

Hardball Talk, reported yesterday that Lohse has yet to receive a FA offer outside of the original qualifying offer from the Cards. Lohse has expressed his frustration recently on the St. Louis airwaves...btw, he also said he has not heard from the Cards org for a few months.

I am merely throwing an idea out there that, as I said that will likely never happen....That being said the Tribe has reportedly expressed interest in spending more money if the conditions are right. Could Lohse become frustrated with the process and bite on the idea of being a FA w/o being tied to draft pk compensation? He might, it's doubtful Boras would advise him to do so. Though the promise of FA riches and freedom might cause Lohse to bite.

The reality of the situation is Lohse probably waits as long as Spring Training to sign with a team. Once ST starts and a significant injury occurs to a teams SP, they likely jump in on him. Of course there was some speculation the Tigers would jump in on Lohse a la Prince Fielder last season...

In summation call me crazy, I call it a creative mind at work...nevertheless, it's all trivial.

[daingean]

Prosecutor,

You only quoted a small fragment... That was the catcher, with the presupposition that Lohse would recieve a guarantee to enter FA again w/o being tied to a qualifying offer. That's HUGE... The post also included $3 M in incentives and the potential for 2 yrs / $28 M more in the form of a mutual option. Lohse would come at the cost of a third rd pk. At that point it's much cheaper than any other team would have to give.

Hardball Talk, reported yesterday that Lohse has yet to receive a FA offer outside of the original qualifying offer from the Cards. Lohse has expressed his frustration recently on the St. Louis airwaves...btw, he also said he has not heard from the Cards org for a few months.

I am merely throwing an idea out there that, as I said that will likely never happen....That being said the Tribe has reportedly expressed interest in spending more money if the conditions are right. Could Lohse become frustrated with the process and bite on the idea of being a FA w/o being tied to draft pk compensation? He might, it's doubtful Boras would advise him to do so. Though the promise of FA riches and freedom might cause Lohse to bite.

The reality of the situation is Lohse probably waits as long as Spring Training to sign with a team. Once ST starts and a significant injury occurs to a teams SP, they likely jump in on him. Of course there was some speculation the Tigers would jump in on Lohse a la Prince Fielder last season...

In summation call me crazy, I call it a creative mind at work...nevertheless, it's all trivial.

I still do not believe that Lohse would sign a 1 year deal. I know he does blame the compensation pick as to why he hasn't signed but I think it is a combination of the comp pick plus Boras' demand. He will end up signing a 4-5 year deal but maybe only in the $8-12 million dollar range. As a pitcher, Lohse will want that long term security over the extra cash. Also, when players say they haven't heard from such and such team doesn't mean there isn't contact between the team and his agent.

[GoTribe028]

Prosecutor,

You only quoted a small fragment... That was the catcher, with the presupposition that Lohse would recieve a guarantee to enter FA again w/o being tied to a qualifying offer. That's HUGE... The post also included $3 M in incentives and the potential for 2 yrs / $28 M more in the form of a mutual option. Lohse would come at the cost of a third rd pk. At that point it's much cheaper than any other team would have to give.

Hardball Talk, reported yesterday that Lohse has yet to receive a FA offer outside of the original qualifying offer from the Cards. Lohse has expressed his frustration recently on the St. Louis airwaves...btw, he also said he has not heard from the Cards org for a few months.

I am merely throwing an idea out there that, as I said that will likely never happen....That being said the Tribe has reportedly expressed interest in spending more money if the conditions are right. Could Lohse become frustrated with the process and bite on the idea of being a FA w/o being tied to draft pk compensation? He might, it's doubtful Boras would advise him to do so. Though the promise of FA riches and freedom might cause Lohse to bite.

The reality of the situation is Lohse probably waits as long as Spring Training to sign with a team. Once ST starts and a significant injury occurs to a teams SP, they likely jump in on him. Of course there was some speculation the Tigers would jump in on Lohse a la Prince Fielder last season...

In summation call me crazy, I call it a creative mind at work...nevertheless, it's all trivial.

I still do not believe that Lohse would sign a 1 year deal. I know he does blame the compensation pick as to why he hasn't signed but I think it is a combination of the comp pick plus Boras' demand. He will end up signing a 4-5 year deal but maybe only in the $8-12 million dollar range. As a pitcher, Lohse will want that long term security over the extra cash. Also, when players say they haven't heard from such and such team doesn't mean there isn't contact between the team and his agent.

Yeah I will be surprised of Lohse would take a 1 year "pillow" contract as they've been called. A team will bite when his demands come down a bit and spring gets closer. Lohse has a much better track record over a pitcher like Edwin Jackson and even though he's older, a team will still value that.

Now, if Shawn Marcum could be had on a deal similar to Brett Myers...Get it done. But a lot of teams are simply waiting on the players to come down in asking price.

Also it's still possible that a scenario plays out to avoid teams losing their draft pick compensation.

[GeronimoSon]

...In summation call me crazy, I call it a creative mind at work....

I'm gonna go with calling you crazy.. now, if you were wealthy, then you could be eccentric !!..(hello dennis hopper..)

One year deal for Lohse..having Tito put that big arm around Lohse's shoulder and tell him that he's wanted here on the north coast seems to have an effect. Maybe Tito can use the "come home to the AL Central where we'll treat you like family!! (Mentor Mitsubishi, eat your heart out..)

Oh..did I mention Tito's influence on the Indians fortunes during this off season... like the only poster who regularly does..

After all is said and done.. a one year deal, player option(s) and major cash ($ 14 - $ 18 MM) with incentives included would be the only chance, albeit unlikely, as you've said that Lohse comes here.. If he's a 4 WAR SP, that would double his value to the club (using the very bad WAR valuation quotient from CA/MS).

[homerawayfromhome]

A minor note...

It seems Jeanmar Gomez could be traded. If this is the case, he has cleared waivers bc in order for a player to be tradable they have to clear waivers first.

Jordan Bastian tweeted; "Status of RHP Jeanmar Gomez (DFA'd a few days ago) remains undetermined. There's a chance Indians might be able to trade the pitcher."

Another note from mlbtraderumors.com, the Indians have discussed a potential trade of Gomez with several clubs including the Twins.

Here's a link... http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/minnesota ... index.html

[GeronimoSon]

A minor note...It seems Jeanmar Gomez could be traded. If this is the case, he has cleared waivers bc in order for a player to be tradable they have to clear waivers first. Jordan Bastian tweeted; "Status of RHP Jeanmar Gomez (DFA'd a few days ago) remains undetermined. There's a chance Indians might be able to trade the pitcher." Another note from mlbtraderumors.com, the Indians have discussed a potential trade of Gomez with several clubs including the Twins. Here's a link... http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/minnesota ... index.html

Homer.. it appears that Gomez will be traded for the PTBNL or cash considerations. He might be the guy the Indians send to the Rangers so they can put McGuinness in the minors.. something like that... Sad, Jeanmar had a few brief flashes of brilliance (perfecto v. trenton in AA).. but never seemed to fully develop..

[homerawayfromhome]

A minor note...It seems Jeanmar Gomez could be traded. If this is the case, he has cleared waivers bc in order for a player to be tradable they have to clear waivers first. Jordan Bastian tweeted; "Status of RHP Jeanmar Gomez (DFA'd a few days ago) remains undetermined. There's a chance Indians might be able to trade the pitcher." Another note from mlbtraderumors.com, the Indians have discussed a potential trade of Gomez with several clubs including the Twins. Here's a link... http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/minnesota ... index.html

Homer.. it appears that Gomez will be traded for the PTBNL or cash considerations. He might be the guy the Indians send to the Rangers so they can put McGuinness in the minors.. something like that... Sad, Jeanmar had a few brief flashes of brilliance (perfecto v. trenton in AA).. but never seemed to fully develop..

Agreed, he's one of those fringe type guys, could be useful maybe as a swingman / long reliever somewhere. Only 24, so it's not as if he's a grizzled vet. I'm not sure the Rangers would want Gomez bc he has no options. I'd hope maybe they could get back a young Rookie ball type. Yes, it would take a while to pay off but by taking a player further from the bigs, perhaps they land someone of use at a later point, instead of AA roster fodder.

[homerawayfromhome]

I've been scouring over the FA list for fits for the Tribes needs here's a few names the Tribe might be able to squeeze into their budget.

DH's:
Delmon Young - DH / LF ...He will probably be the most costly $$$ on this DH list.
Luke Scott - DH / LF / 1b ...Still has some pop, might come cheap.
Kelly Johnson - DH / LF / 2b ...Hasn't played LF in a while.
Carlos Lee - DH / 1b ...pro hitter, little pop left.
Jim Thome - DH ...would be a fan favorite as a part-time player.
Travis Hafner - DH ...see Thome.

LHRP:
Manny Parra ...Gets a lot of K's, but posts an ugly ERA.

SP:
Shaun Marcum ...Price is still too high in length and dollars.
Joe Saunders ...Decent lefty, logs some innings.
Jair Jurrgens ...might be the guy for a BOR spot.
Erik Bedard ...Umm, maybe better in a relief role?
Jonathon Sanchez ...see Bedard.

[GeronimoSon]

A minor note...It seems Jeanmar Gomez could be traded. If this is the case, he has cleared waivers bc in order for a player to be tradable they have to clear waivers first. Jordan Bastian tweeted; "Status of RHP Jeanmar Gomez (DFA'd a few days ago) remains undetermined. There's a chance Indians might be able to trade the pitcher." Another note from mlbtraderumors.com, the Indians have discussed a potential trade of Gomez with several clubs including the Twins. Here's a link... http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/minnesota ... index.html

Homer.. it appears that Gomez will be traded for the PTBNL or cash considerations. He might be the guy the Indians send to the Rangers so they can put McGuinness in the minors.. something like that... Sad, Jeanmar had a few brief flashes of brilliance (perfecto v. trenton in AA).. but never seemed to fully develop..

Agreed, he's one of those fringe type guys, could be useful maybe as a swingman / long reliever somewhere. Only 24, so it's not as if he's a grizzled vet. I'm not sure the Rangers would want Gomez bc he has no options. I'd hope maybe they could get back a young Rookie ball type. Yes, it would take a while to pay off but by taking a player further from the bigs, perhaps they land someone of use at a later point, instead of AA roster fodder.

So, someone like Giovanni Soto, the guy the Indians got from the Tigers in the Jhonny P trade?. (a trade that hasn't been much at all.. but, Gio is still only 21..)

[GoTribe028]

A minor note...It seems Jeanmar Gomez could be traded. If this is the case, he has cleared waivers bc in order for a player to be tradable they have to clear waivers first. Jordan Bastian tweeted; "Status of RHP Jeanmar Gomez (DFA'd a few days ago) remains undetermined. There's a chance Indians might be able to trade the pitcher." Another note from mlbtraderumors.com, the Indians have discussed a potential trade of Gomez with several clubs including the Twins. Here's a link... http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/minnesota ... index.html

Homer.. it appears that Gomez will be traded for the PTBNL or cash considerations. He might be the guy the Indians send to the Rangers so they can put McGuinness in the minors.. something like that... Sad, Jeanmar had a few brief flashes of brilliance (perfecto v. trenton in AA).. but never seemed to fully develop..

Agreed, he's one of those fringe type guys, could be useful maybe as a swingman / long reliever somewhere. Only 24, so it's not as if he's a grizzled vet. I'm not sure the Rangers would want Gomez bc he has no options. I'd hope maybe they could get back a young Rookie ball type. Yes, it would take a while to pay off but by taking a player further from the bigs, perhaps they land someone of use at a later point, instead of AA roster fodder.

So, someone like Giovanni Soto, the guy the Indians got from the Tigers in the Jhonny P trade?. (a trade that hasn't been much at all.. but, Gio is still only 21..)

Actually Spto is developing nicely into a solid left handed option down the line. Could be a Raffy Left type eventually. Wasn't expecting anything from him when we got him for Peralta, so the fact that he's showing progress is nice.

[GoTribe028]

I've been scouring over the FA list for fits for the Tribes needs here's a few names the Tribe might be able to squeeze into their budget.

DH's:
Delmon Young - DH / LF ...He will probably be the most costly $$$ on this DH list.
Luke Scott - DH / LF / 1b ...Still has some pop, might come cheap.
Kelly Johnson - DH / LF / 2b ...Hasn't played LF in a while.
Carlos Lee - DH / 1b ...pro hitter, little pop left.
Jim Thome - DH ...would be a fan favorite as a part-time player.
Travis Hafner - DH ...see Thome.

LHRP:
Manny Parra ...Gets a lot of K's, but posts an ugly ERA.

SP:
Shaun Marcum ...Price is still too high in length and dollars.
Joe Saunders ...Decent lefty, logs some innings.
Jair Jurrgens ...might be the guy for a BOR spot.
Erik Bedard ...Umm, maybe better in a relief role?
Jonathon Sanchez ...see Bedard.

FWIW

@Jim_Duquette: President of the Indians Mark Shapiro joined us, said their still looking for a LHH bat to DH or play 1B or a corner OF bat, as well as starting pitching

I think you mentioned Kelly Johnson a few days ago and I remember really liking the idea. Not to crazy about Luke Scott though,or Delmon Young for that matter. Would rather not see the Indians commit a roster spot to a DH that will only get them 70-80 games without playing the field, ie. Thome/Hafner

Marcum, Saunders and Jurrgens to a lesser extent would help out. I wouldn't even look at Sanchez but Bedard as a lefty in the pen could be solid. Don't feel he'd take that roll however.

[daingean]

I've been scouring over the FA list for fits for the Tribes needs here's a few names the Tribe might be able to squeeze into their budget.

DH's:
Delmon Young - DH / LF ...He will probably be the most costly $$$ on this DH list.
Luke Scott - DH / LF / 1b ...Still has some pop, might come cheap.
Kelly Johnson - DH / LF / 2b ...Hasn't played LF in a while.
Carlos Lee - DH / 1b ...pro hitter, little pop left.
Jim Thome - DH ...would be a fan favorite as a part-time player.
Travis Hafner - DH ...see Thome.

LHRP:
Manny Parra ...Gets a lot of K's, but posts an ugly ERA.

SP:
Shaun Marcum ...Price is still too high in length and dollars.
Joe Saunders ...Decent lefty, logs some innings.
Jair Jurrgens ...might be the guy for a BOR spot.
Erik Bedard ...Umm, maybe better in a relief role?
Jonathon Sanchez ...see Bedard.

I am one that says no to full time DH's. We would be better off using a 12th pitcher with a 4 man bench so everyone on the bench must be able to play multiple positions (with the exception of a back up catcher). So I don't want Thome or Hafner. If an OF is signed, he must be able to man RF. Now Parra would be #1 on my list of those mentioned above.

Bench + DH:
Aviles - utility guy will play 3 times a week either resting A-Cab, Kipnis, Chiz or letting them DH
Gomez - 3rd catcher which lets the team DH Santana 2 twice a week and versatile enough to play the field
Marson - backup defensive catcher
Carrerra - Speed on the bench is nice in late inning pinch running + defensive replacement when needed
McDade/McGuinness/LaPorta - this is where i'd slot a corner OF bench guy but would be nice to have someone with some pop in his bat

BP (ultimately I'd like another lefty spot but the first 6 below have to be penciled in for now):

CPerez, Pestano, Smith, Albers, Shaw, Allen, Hagadone/Barnes/Kazmir/Huff/lefty_Acquisition

As for SP, I'd like to add a lefty but only one better than our 1st 4 below.

SP: Masterson, Ubaldo, Meyers, Bauer, Carrasco/McCallister/Huff/Kluber