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Release thread

Talk shop about the various prospects and teams that make up the Cleveland Indians organization.

Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Sat Mar 21, 2009 8:39 am

Gonna be some releases announced in the coming days. Figured I would devote a thread to it.

As I mentioned on the front page, Todd Martin was released. Others were also released, but I am awaiting confirmation. Also, apparently Brian Juhl has retired, but again I am awaiting confirmation on that too.
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Re: Release thread

Postby MadThinker88 » Sat Mar 21, 2009 9:19 am

Although the moves occurred over a week ago, there is also the retirements of Dustin Realini and Kevin Dixon.

It will be interesting to see the revised depth chart after spring training.
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Re: Release thread

Postby artgold » Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:40 am

Todd Martin has had a very odd career. He starts out very late for pro baseball, then dominates the NYPL. In all categories, average, on base and power, he just dominates the league.

Like practically everyone I was a bit doubtful about his performance being sustained at higher levels, figuring he was just very old for the league. He starts out the next season at Kinston and statistically confirms the doubt, but he only plays a few weeks and is then on the disabled list an extended period. He then returns, and tears up the South Atlantic League in a brief appearance.

Then he retires.

Think he will be Roy Hobbs in another 10 years???
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Re: Release thread

Postby MadThinker88 » Sat Mar 21, 2009 1:03 pm

It would be nice if Adam Miller can be Roy Hobbs in 6 years.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Mon Mar 23, 2009 8:59 am

I don't think Todd Martin retired.....


Thought Tony said he was released...


Maybe they're opening a DH spot for Andy Marte at Akron ;)
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:08 am

Yeah, Martin was released. He is going to play independent ball and try to latch on somewhere else.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Fri Mar 27, 2009 4:52 pm

RHP P.J. Zocchi was released yesterday. Several cuts are expected tonight or tomorrow morning as it was a short camp day today and the staff is getting together to start weeding out some players.
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:02 am

I interviewed Zocchi when he was in extended spring training last year. I did not like the vibe I got from him at the time as far as being a good teammate and being humble about his position in the organization. The fact that he was released this early is no surprise to me at all.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:03 am

Brad Hinkle, Garrett Rieck, Candido Jesus and Wilfredo Ramirez were released over the weekend. A few others too, but unknown at this time. And more coming.
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:10 am

I am really shocked about Hinkle. Rieck has been here a couple of years and couldn't even break through to high A.

I know Tony has taught me a couple of aspects I was not aware of regarding the pressure these guys are under. Not only is it financial and trying to make the majors but it is also getting cut, which happens a lot more in ST, I think, than during the season. Newsom has said it before. As a low guy on the rankings every pitch, every outing could be your last if you do not perform.

That being said, I can't believe Hinkle. He is huge and low A relievers are usually organizational fodder so why not give the guy a full season before dumping him?

In any case, more of the top 100 (starting with Martin) are being lost.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:22 pm

dnosco wrote:In any case, more of the top 100 (starting with Martin) are being lost.


Yeah, and probably a few more to come as well!
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Re: Release thread

Postby Upper Box Woodchuck » Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:23 am

Hermie13 wrote:Maybe they're opening a DH spot for Andy Marte at Akron ;)


Nah, he's probably going to hang out with George Lombard on the Clippers' bench.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:36 am

Upper Box Woodchuck wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:Maybe they're opening a DH spot for Andy Marte at Akron ;)


Nah, he's probably going to hang out with George Lombard on the Clippers' bench.


unless Aubrey gets cut, I don't see both those guys there....

Only 3 bench spots (unless they keep less relievers).

One is Gimenez/Torregas as backup catcher. The other will be a backup middle infielder such as Cannizaro/Graffanino/Valdez/Merchan....one will start...one will backup.

That leaves 1 other spot open for either Marte, Lombard, or one of the previously mentioned middle infielders.....

(Note: I'm assuming Head starts in the OF, or at least on the team....if he goes to the DL then there's a chance both could make it....but only then).
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Re: Release thread

Postby carnegie44115 » Thu Apr 02, 2009 3:21 pm

According to Garrett Rieck's facebook page, he has signed with the Schaumburg Flyers.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Fri Apr 03, 2009 2:58 am

Forgot to mention that outfielders Angel Rodriguez and Juan Valdes were released last week.

Also, the following players were released during an insane day on Thursday: Greg Jones (RHP), Matt Esquivel (OF), Todd Moser (LHP), Brandon Pinckney (INF), Jansy Infante (INF), Joanniel Montero (RHP), Cirilo Cumberbatch (OF), Mauro Zarate (RHP), and Jeff Hehr (INF).

There was another player or two, but can't remember.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:07 am

Was Ohka released? Noticed he wasn't listed in the Columbus rotation.....
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:56 am

Too bad guys have to be released. This infatuation with veterans in the AAA bullpen is puzzling. I would rather have an organizational guy take those innings. At least those organizational guys have some limited upside. As I have said, Scott Roehl is the perfect example. Give the guy a shot at AAA. He might give you a few good innings in the majors once he gets his feet wet at AAA.

p.s., always sad when guys get released. As I remember Hehr is a Cleveland kid who was excited when the Indians drafted him. None of the rest of the guys on the list surprise me at all. Pinckney has always been thought of by this organization as an organizational guy and has never gotten respect even though he put up good offensive numbers at AA at a relatively young age.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:11 am

dnosco wrote:Too bad guys have to be released. This infatuation with veterans in the AAA bullpen is puzzling. I would rather have an organizational guy take those innings. At least those organizational guys have some limited upside. As I have said, Scott Roehl is the perfect example. Give the guy a shot at AAA. He might give you a few good innings in the majors once he gets his feet wet at AAA.

p.s., always sad when guys get released. As I remember Hehr is a Cleveland kid who was excited when the Indians drafted him. None of the rest of the guys on the list surprise me at all. Pinckney has always been thought of by this organization as an organizational guy and has never gotten respect even though he put up good offensive numbers at AA at a relatively young age.


Veterans have as good or even a better chance of giving you a few good innings at the ML level though.

At least you know these vets have the ability to perform at the ML level.....

That being said, I think you will see some of these guys move up and the vets cut eventually. Kind of like Lewis's rise in 2007 (from AA to ML) or Mujica's in 2006.

I also wonder if Roehl will be the closer at Akron? He did a good job in that role in Kinston in 2007 and had 7 saves at Akron last year.
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Re: Release thread

Postby artgold » Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:11 am

Just want to mention that Todd Moser was a really engaging and friendly guy. I hope he gets to stay in baseball as a coach someday. He has a great personality, and was one of the few players you could talk with during the workout sessions on the field.
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Fri Apr 03, 2009 1:25 pm

Hermie,

Because I am a minor league fan I have a prejudice against AAAA players from outside the organization so take what I am about to say with a grain of salt. What we know about these veterans is,usually, they are so poor they can't get a major league job. Now, while they may be better than a Scott Roehl, I have a soft spot in my heart for these kinds of guys and, over the last couple of years, have seen dozens of Roehl kind of guys come up and give you a few decent performances.

As a former athlete and as a coach it is always my thought to give the guy from th organization the first shot. For example, Brad Snyder last year instead of Jason Tyner. Some minor league pitcher from our organization instead of the Rick Bauers of the world.

Just my position but these AAAA guys seem to invariably stink once they get to the majors and having them around just hurts morale of the younger guys and organizational guys who have plugged along for years.

Look, most of these guys are realists. They know that their ability only makes them fringe major leaguers. They would just like to get that shot and, to me, I understand and uber empathize with them.

To me the AAAA veterans are just a ridiculous waste of money (they get paid SIGNIFICANTLY more, as I understand it, then our internal guys as they have ML experience) and a morale buster as keeping them pushes everyone down the organization.

I mean, in how many professions does it tick people off that you can't GET experience unless you already HAVE experience.

To go back to one of my old examples, Chris Coste has made a nice niche career for himself in Philly when just one team gave him a chance. Myabe it is not totally pragmatic but I like the heartwarming study of the organizational guy making it. Face it, from our recent experience with the AAAA retreads who have passed through here and failed miserably, living up to their career stats and AAAA reps, don't YOU want to see some fresh face, too?

Regarding Moser, he is 32 years old. While I acknowledge what you say, my heart goes out to all these guys but moreso to the guys who haven't been kicking around the minors for 10 years. Good guy, I am sure, and I wish him the best. I just see this organization continually giving chances to guys who have failed other places and not giving chances to internal guys who have earned it by performance.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Apr 03, 2009 2:45 pm

dnosco wrote:Hermie,

Because I am a minor league fan I have a prejudice against AAAA players from outside the organization so take what I am about to say with a grain of salt. What we know about these veterans is,usually, they are so poor they can't get a major league job. Now, while they may be better than a Scott Roehl, I have a soft spot in my heart for these kinds of guys and, over the last couple of years, have seen dozens of Roehl kind of guys come up and give you a few decent performances.

As a former athlete and as a coach it is always my thought to give the guy from th organization the first shot. For example, Brad Snyder last year instead of Jason Tyner. Some minor league pitcher from our organization instead of the Rick Bauers of the world.

Just my position but these AAAA guys seem to invariably stink once they get to the majors and having them around just hurts morale of the younger guys and organizational guys who have plugged along for years.

Look, most of these guys are realists. They know that their ability only makes them fringe major leaguers. They would just like to get that shot and, to me, I understand and uber empathize with them.

To me the AAAA veterans are just a ridiculous waste of money (they get paid SIGNIFICANTLY more, as I understand it, then our internal guys as they have ML experience) and a morale buster as keeping them pushes everyone down the organization.

I mean, in how many professions does it tick people off that you can't GET experience unless you already HAVE experience.

To go back to one of my old examples, Chris Coste has made a nice niche career for himself in Philly when just one team gave him a chance. Myabe it is not totally pragmatic but I like the heartwarming study of the organizational guy making it. Face it, from our recent experience with the AAAA retreads who have passed through here and failed miserably, living up to their career stats and AAAA reps, don't YOU want to see some fresh face, too?

Regarding Moser, he is 32 years old. While I acknowledge what you say, my heart goes out to all these guys but moreso to the guys who haven't been kicking around the minors for 10 years. Good guy, I am sure, and I wish him the best. I just see this organization continually giving chances to guys who have failed other places and not giving chances to internal guys who have earned it by performance.


I actually loved Chris Coste when he was in Buffalo and was really pulling for him to get promoted......but he was 27 before he even played in the Indians organization.....not sure I'd call him an 'organizational guy'....


Who do 'I' want to see on the field? I want to see the guys that give the Indians THE BEST CHANGE TO WIN THIS YEAR. Which is why at the time I was fine with bringing up Tyner over Snyder.

Now, are those guys that will give us the best chance to win now these vets that have had good years in the MLs (Chulk hasn't been 'that' bad lately) or the guys that haven't pitched above AA like Roehl? Hard to say.....could be one...could be the other....heck could be both...or could be neither....(wow, that sounded kind of weird).


AAA has always and will always be a place for veterans 'retreads' (if that's what you like calling them) in the bullpen, especially on a team that thinks it can win its division this year.


I agree with a lot of what you say, and I too like seeing the young guys come up.....but you're acting like the Tribe truly blocks them with vets, which just does NOT seem to be the case to me.

Yes, the Tribe does bring in vets a lot to give depth and experience to the pen (and even other areas at times), but the Tribe has shown they will NOT hesitate to cut loose one to bring up a youngster if they are performing, even if it's a guy that started the year in AA like a Mujica or Lewis.

They don't bring up Vets typically from the minors unless they are performing well, such as Bauer last year. He was off to a great start in AAA....so why not bring him up? Yes, he stuck it up at the ML level, but we needed something. No young guy was performing as well as him in the minors at that point.

I'm assuming you also kind of referring to Donnelly and Rincon late last year. I think the Tribe did the right hting there though. The season was lost of sorts. We needed to see if one of those guys could turn their careers around and do something for the Tribe come 2009. Obviously neither stepped up.....but did they really take any young guys spot? Ok, so maybe Mastny.....but he was well on his way to becoming one of them in his own right.

We just don't have a lot of 'good' bullpen guys in the minors. If they perform, then they will get the call. Tribe has proven they will do this the last few years.

We'd be absolutely screwed if we had zero vets in AAA and needed an arm now. Most of the young guys just aren't ready for the show yet.

Meloan is one....but don't forget, he was in the rotation in AAA with LA last year. Tribe wanted him to focus on working out of the pen before bumping him up. Sipp has been great....but did have a sore arm at the onset of spring training. Not the worst thing to hold him back a bit.

Both these guys should get calls, along with Chulk before the end of May. This will allow for guys like Edell, Roehl....and maybe Newsom if he ever learns how to not walk more guys than he strikes out, to move up to AAA.


I also agree, it is nice to see guys from within the organization do well with us and come up.....but that shouldn't be the main factor in calling up a guy IMO.....it should be as I said 'who gives us the best chance to win today'.....
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Fri Apr 03, 2009 5:16 pm

While I agree to some extent, the young guys are on the way up and the veterans are, in reality, on the way down. We can debate how much higher the young guys will get and whether they will ever pass the AAAA guys and, as you said, which one gives us the best chance to win at that moment. The problem is that the difference is probably negligible and, for simple surprise factor, may favor the guy who has never been in the majors.

The problem with these AAAA guys, and Bauer is a great example, is that they stink in the majors, which is why they are AAAA guys. My experience with these guys, especially pitchers and utility infielders that the Indians bring in, is that they may look good at AAA but, when they get to the majors, they stink to the level they have always stunk in the past.

The point is that it appears to me that Wedge and Shapiro like the security blanket of a guy having played in the majors as compared to a guy with mediocre stuff like Roehl who has had success but has never played in the majors. That is where I disagree with them. If the guy is an organizational guy to them who doesn't have a great ML future and your choice is that guy or the AAAA guy who has failed every time they have been given a chance, why not go with the young guy. You may get a month or so of good ball out of him until the league figures him out. The AAAA guys? Not so much as the league has figured them out years before.

I'll have to take a look at players who made their ML debuts last year and see what direction other teams go in this regard.

As I said, I am sentimental about these guys. Maybe it clouds my objectivity but, if nothing else, if both types have a really similar chance for success...or failure, give the guy from your organization a chance. Hey, it may be his only chance ever whereas the AAAA guy has had his chance, or two, or three, already.
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Fri Apr 03, 2009 5:18 pm

Hermie,

BTW, I have had this discussion many times in the past. It never changes anything and is really futile on my part. I guess it is just cathertic for me as I see guys who I think should at least get one chance never get one.
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Re: Release thread

Postby kman » Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:25 pm

dnosco,

I too have a soft sopt for guys like roehl. And a wont to win. These younger guys need a shot. they have busted there butts for years and should be given a shot. I also want to win, but if these retreads cant get it done move on. To that i have to admit some of the retreads do do well on new teams. So where do u draw the line? Thats why they pay the big buck to GMs. Although i think most of them are just throwing darts at the wall and dont want to be the ones that give a younger guy a shot and fail. That sucks! For the younger guys, the team and the fan. I dont think Roehl will get a shot. He has more the put up the numbers. I dont think there has ever been a ML that has ever been perfect in every game. Nor has a guy like roehl, But why not just give these guys a shot. What do they think these guys are going to go out and pitch/play well after been told they are not moving up again, or hey you had a 1.04 era as a starter last year, but now u are working out of the pen at the same level the following year. In short it sucks that these guys work so hard and get left in the minors, as retreads move up ans still can"t get the job done.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:49 am

dnosco wrote:While I agree to some extent, the young guys are on the way up and the veterans are, in reality, on the way down. We can debate how much higher the young guys will get and whether they will ever pass the AAAA guys and, as you said, which one gives us the best chance to win at that moment. The problem is that the difference is probably negligible and, for simple surprise factor, may favor the guy who has never been in the majors.

The problem with these AAAA guys, and Bauer is a great example, is that they stink in the majors, which is why they are AAAA guys. My experience with these guys, especially pitchers and utility infielders that the Indians bring in, is that they may look good at AAA but, when they get to the majors, they stink to the level they have always stunk in the past.

The point is that it appears to me that Wedge and Shapiro like the security blanket of a guy having played in the majors as compared to a guy with mediocre stuff like Roehl who has had success but has never played in the majors. That is where I disagree with them. If the guy is an organizational guy to them who doesn't have a great ML future and your choice is that guy or the AAAA guy who has failed every time they have been given a chance, why not go with the young guy. You may get a month or so of good ball out of him until the league figures him out. The AAAA guys? Not so much as the league has figured them out years before.

I'll have to take a look at players who made their ML debuts last year and see what direction other teams go in this regard.

As I said, I am sentimental about these guys. Maybe it clouds my objectivity but, if nothing else, if both types have a really similar chance for success...or failure, give the guy from your organization a chance. Hey, it may be his only chance ever whereas the AAAA guy has had his chance, or two, or three, already.


ha, no worries on the repeating yourself and expressing your views multiple times. We all are guilty of this to some extent.


I disagree a bit here. Guys like Chulk and Herges have actually had bouts of success at the ML level. Take Vinnie Chulk for example. he's never been dominate (no one is saying he is), but in 2007 did threw 53 innings while have a WHIP of 1.26 then last year had one of 1.29. Not 'great' numbers....but consider what other Tribe bullpen guys did last year....

Only Raffy Perez (1.18) had a lower WHIP with more than 20 IP in the pen last year. Lewis was 1.44, Kobayashi was 1.42, and Raffy Betancourt was 1.42.

Yes, his BAA have been in the .260 range lately.....but that's right on par with guys like Lewis, Rundles, and heck even Elarton last year. Again, only Perez was better really.

Herges has definitely had some good seasons....but is nearing the end of the line. Was fantastic for the Rockies in the World Series run of 2007...but quite terrible last year. Has he been cut or 'traded' yet? I'll be suprised if he pitches in Columbus.

Greg Aquino is the one guy I'm not really thrilled about at Columbus. Even so, he too has had some ML success. Very good rookie year in 2004 coming out of the pen for the D'backs. Been pretty bad ever since though.

Jose Rodriguez is a lefty.....and that's all I can think of why we're keeping him at AAA (if Tony's projections are true). He is a bit of an intriguing guy.....but I'm really not expecting anything from him.

I could do without the last two at AAA.....but have absolutely no beef with Chulk, who will be gone by May 15th one way or another (either ML or released), which will allow for a guy like Edell to move up.

Edell is really the only guy I see at AA (in the pen) that really has a legit beef not being in AAA to start the year....and with him moving to the pen, a quick start at AA isn't the worst thing.

It honestly sickens me when people say Newsom belongs up in AAA. He shouldn't ever be allowed back to AAA til he learns to walk fewer guys than he strikes out.


Guess what I'm getting at is I agree to an extent. I do like havinga vet or two in reserve....but 3 or more is a bit overkill, which is what the Tribe has done the last two years. Though again, 1 or 2 should be gone quickly, which won't hinder the moves of the younger guys up the ladder much at all.


Also, just curious.....what are your thoughts on Rundles? Do you consider him a AAAA guy that shouldn't be in AAA wasting a spot or do you consider him a decent organizational guy?
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Mon Apr 06, 2009 4:45 pm

I had originally considered Rundles a AAAA guy but then thought he might have developed himself into a LOOGY. Now I think he is looking like a AAAA guy.
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:42 pm

John Allman has apparently replaced Jason Denham on the Kinston roster, according to the Kinston Indians' website. Don't know the whereabouts of Denham.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:50 am

dnosco wrote:I had originally considered Rundles a AAAA guy but then thought he might have developed himself into a LOOGY. Now I think he is looking like a AAAA guy.


Yeah, I've never really been a big fan of Rundles. though he does appear like a guy that could give us a few good innings this year. With Sipp looking strong though, not really sure he's needed....
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Tue Apr 07, 2009 10:43 am

Yes, Allman to Kinston is official. Hearing that Denham may have been released.

Odd how these rosters always change a little bit days before the season starts...
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:48 pm

Feel bad for Denham if this is the case. You know, you have the whole spring training (and the winter before, according to your comments, Tony) and you STILL have to make up rosters and then, a short time later, change them again? I mean, how much more do they want to rip these guys' hearts out?

BTW, I think Allman is a much better fit for the 5th (or 4th) outfielder spot in Kinston than is a guy like Denham. I don't know if Denham or Pena would be happy if they slipped to that 5th outfielder spot after their previous slotting as real prospects, whereas I think Allman, as a purported organizational guy, is perfect as a 4th or 5th outfielder in his first full year in the organization because guys like him are only looking for a chance and Allman has worked from behind before as he walked on at KU and had a backup role in the GCL in the midst of much younger players last year.

However, again, my prejudice to allow organizational guys to get a chance if they perform is showing through...again.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Apr 07, 2009 3:09 pm

hmm....when had Denham really done that much though? He was good for a SB, but that's about it. Had a good K/BB ratio last year but only played in 60 odd games....
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Re: Release thread

Postby timdav » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:23 pm

Anybody know what happened to: OF George Lombard? Salas, reliever....both expected to be at Columbus, but neither is listed on the Clippers' website this afternoon.

Camacaro might've been released, as Damaso Espino is the other catcher at Akron, per the Aeros' official
roster handed out at today's media day.

Sorry to hear about Denham...and all of the guys who get released.

The 2009 regular season is pretty exciting for us Tribe organization fans, as all of the top 4 Indians farm teams have at least 2 or 3 players with realistic odds of making the majors. It hasn't been that way the last few years. Lots of "organization"/filler type guys before.

But now: La Porta, Brantley, Valbuena, Huff, Sipp, Santana, Mills, Weglarz, Rondon, maybe even Rivero,
Chisenhall, De La Cruz, Phelps, Fedroff, Abreu, A. Perez...and a few others. Wow!

Tim in Akron
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Re: Release thread

Postby artgold » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:56 pm

Jason Denham was a 13th round draft pick, who has a career BA of .247 in the equivalent of about three minor league seasons. Though he has some speed and a decent batting eye, a minor league career SLG of .320 isn't going to get you close to the majors.

I suspect the timing of these releases works out OK for the players though. My understanding is their agents have independent league teams on their speed dial, and can get anyone placed pretty quickly if they want to continue on. Though pretty modest, it still is a paycheck while you try and figure out what to do with the rest of your life.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Tue Apr 07, 2009 10:14 pm

A lot of these last second decisions are affected by what the Indians do at the major league level and who they keep around from their NRI list. There really is no amount of planning that can be done by a farm director as he does not know how many guys the Indians will want to place in Triple-A until the last second when camp breaks. As a result, as has happened this year, with guys like Marte and others now being on the minor league roster when they were not initially planned to be, this creates a ripple throughout the entire system. If 1-2 guys end up back in Akron because of an NRI added to Columbus, that means 1-2 guys end up back in Kinston, 1-2 guys back in Lake County, and 1-2 guys cut. If not more.

Sort of gives me an idea for an article down the road with Atkins, a discussion how this whole process works at the end of spring training. It is pretty well mapped out before camp starts where guys will go, but I am interested to find out how he handles infusing the NRI guys and all that.
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Re: Release thread

Postby martyinnewyork » Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:09 pm

Imagine going to the grave knowing you'd been released so that Andy Marte can slowly decompose on the Columbus bench...
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Re: Release thread

Postby MadThinker88 » Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:25 pm

martyinnewyork wrote:Imagine going to the grave knowing you'd been released so that Andy Marte can slowly decompose on the Columbus bench...


Guess it will inspire someone or drive them to drink & ruin. Either way it will have an impact.
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Re: Release thread

Postby artgold » Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:49 pm

martyinnewyork wrote:Imagine going to the grave knowing you'd been released so that Andy Marte can slowly decompose on the Columbus bench...



Ehh, by the time you tell the grandkids, you were bumped by ARod.
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Re: Release thread

Postby artgold » Tue Apr 07, 2009 11:54 pm

Consigliere wrote:A lot of these last second decisions are affected by what the Indians do at the major league level and who they keep around from their NRI list. There really is no amount of planning that can be done by a farm director as he does not know how many guys the Indians will want to place in Triple-A until the last second when camp breaks. As a result, as has happened this year, with guys like Marte and others now being on the minor league roster when they were not initially planned to be, this creates a ripple throughout the entire system. If 1-2 guys end up back in Akron because of an NRI added to Columbus, that means 1-2 guys end up back in Kinston, 1-2 guys back in Lake County, and 1-2 guys cut. If not more.

Sort of gives me an idea for an article down the road with Atkins, a discussion how this whole process works at the end of spring training. It is pretty well mapped out before camp starts where guys will go, but I am interested to find out how he handles infusing the NRI guys and all that.


Would also be an interesting discussion with an agent, concerning next steps and communication with Indy Leagues.

Another interesting perspective is Indy League guys who get an invite, the contrast between their Indy experience and the pressure of trying to get back to organization minor league teams (guys like Todd Moser and Matt Esquivel).
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Re: Release thread

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:04 am

I too am interested in what is up with Salas.....he looked strong this spring, and with Miller hurting, we could use a power arm like his in AAA....
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:21 pm

I missed these releases when in camp last week, but BA has these additional guys that I did not note: Juan Diaz (RHP), Jose Jimenez (RHP), Jacob Reust (RHP), Jose Rodriguez (LHP).
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Re: Release thread

Postby dnosco » Wed Apr 08, 2009 1:03 pm

Reust is the Australian kid. When I interviewed Mirabelli when they signed Reust he did not even put him in the same class as Smit who still has not gotten out of A ball. Diaz had good DSL numbers a couple of years ago and Jimenez seemed to have something so these releases, with extended spring training still going on and these guys' limited US experience, sort of surprises me.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Upper Box Woodchuck » Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:51 pm

artgold wrote:
Consigliere wrote:A lot of these last second decisions are affected by what the Indians do at the major league level and who they keep around from their NRI list. There really is no amount of planning that can be done by a farm director as he does not know how many guys the Indians will want to place in Triple-A until the last second when camp breaks. As a result, as has happened this year, with guys like Marte and others now being on the minor league roster when they were not initially planned to be, this creates a ripple throughout the entire system. If 1-2 guys end up back in Akron because of an NRI added to Columbus, that means 1-2 guys end up back in Kinston, 1-2 guys back in Lake County, and 1-2 guys cut. If not more.

Sort of gives me an idea for an article down the road with Atkins, a discussion how this whole process works at the end of spring training. It is pretty well mapped out before camp starts where guys will go, but I am interested to find out how he handles infusing the NRI guys and all that.


Would also be an interesting discussion with an agent, concerning next steps and communication with Indy Leagues.

Another interesting perspective is Indy League guys who get an invite, the contrast between their Indy experience and the pressure of trying to get back to organization minor league teams (guys like Todd Moser and Matt Esquivel).


Avon has got an Indy League team starting this summer. It should be pretty easy to get an interview with a guy who signed with a Frontier League club (I seem to remember at least one doing so) when they come to town (probably easier yet if one of them signs with the Crushers).
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:47 pm

Yeah, I know several of the indians guys released in the last two years I can approach about such a piece. It is added to my list.

My first feature piece will be on extended spring training, and hope to have that up sometime this weekend or next week. Talked to Ted Kubiak at length about it while in Arizona last week, and should have some insight from him and some players from there as well.
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Re: Release thread

Postby Upper Box Woodchuck » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:49 pm

Consigliere wrote:Yeah, I know several of the indians guys released in the last two years I can approach about such a piece. It is added to my list.

My first feature piece will be on extended spring training, and hope to have that up sometime this weekend or next week. Talked to Ted Kubiak at length about it while in Arizona last week, and should have some insight from him and some players from there as well.


Will there be any boxscores from extended/short-season spring training posted?

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I'm new to the site.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:50 pm

No, probably no box scores from EST.

By the way, got word that Robbie Alcombrack was released.
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Re: Release thread

Postby artgold » Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:40 pm

Consigliere wrote:No, probably no box scores from EST.

By the way, got word that Robbie Alcombrack was released.



A bit surprised to read this, though he has had some difficulties he is only 20 years old and has some power potential at a defensive position where it has some value. I would have thought they would have at least given him another season.
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Re: Release thread

Postby TonyIBI » Fri Apr 10, 2009 12:53 pm

Ok, I have all the releases and the extended roster.

In addition to those mentioned, Jason Denham was in fact released. Also Denny Montero, Jose Rodriguez and Juan Aponte.

Oh, and for whoever asked about Gregorio Rosario, he is still in the org and in extended. He is on the DL (again). Not sure what the injury issues have been.
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Re: Release thread

Postby indianinkslinger » Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:20 pm

artgold wrote:
Consigliere wrote:No, probably no box scores from EST.

By the way, got word that Robbie Alcombrack was released.



A bit surprised to read this, though he has had some difficulties he is only 20 years old and has some power potential at a defensive position where it has some value. I would have thought they would have at least given him another season.

Me 2 Art. Guess my breakout pick really broke out!
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Re: Release thread

Postby petes999 » Fri Apr 10, 2009 2:52 pm

indianinkslinger wrote:
artgold wrote:
Consigliere wrote:No, probably no box scores from EST.

By the way, got word that Robbie Alcombrack was released.



A bit surprised to read this, though he has had some difficulties he is only 20 years old and has some power potential at a defensive position where it has some value. I would have thought they would have at least given him another season.

Me 2 Art. Guess my breakout pick really broke out!


I was surprised at this as well as we had really no one at Lake County -- didn't Tony say that they two catchers are organizational players?
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Re: Release thread

Postby indianinkslinger » Fri Apr 10, 2009 4:14 pm

petes999 wrote:
indianinkslinger wrote:
artgold wrote:
Consigliere wrote:No, probably no box scores from EST.

By the way, got word that Robbie Alcombrack was released.



A bit surprised to read this, though he has had some difficulties he is only 20 years old and has some power potential at a defensive position where it has some value. I would have thought they would have at least given him another season.

Me 2 Art. Guess my breakout pick really broke out!


I was surprised at this as well as we had really no one at Lake County -- didn't Tony say that they two catchers are organizational players?

My best guess would be that the conversion of Abraham to catcher must have gone well. I was going to ask Tony if he had heard anything specific about that since he started opening day and had a couple of hits. I don't know if Tony ever provided a specific opinion on Abraham but he did not make the book and that says volumes. I offered up the opinion during draft time that he would be little more than an organizational player who gave everything he had every game. I watched him at 3B and 1B and saw no future in either position for him. Cleveland must have seen something because Tony rated Alcombrack 77th and I confess he was a little higher on my list. There were rumors about his conditioning and work ethic that caused concern but i thought he had some ceiling. Maybe Tony will favor us with his thoughts on this.
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