RSS Twitter Facebook YouTube
Expand Menu

2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Talk shop about the various prospects and teams that make up the Cleveland Indians organization.

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Lloyd Christmas » Wed Jun 15, 2011 6:13 pm

Yeah Id like to see Valbuena come up
Lloyd Christmas
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 248
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:18 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Edible14 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 6:14 pm

indianinkslinger wrote:Is it time to take a good look at two prospects who have fallen into the AAAA category? I am speaking of Huffman and Valbuena. It makes some sense to me with the way the Indians lineup is going. Don't get me wrong. I do not believe either of these two are a long term answer to the problems with our field players but neither are worth anything in trade and might help fill some gaps short term.

Huffman is not real good defensively and is a streaky hitter who does not hit LHP particularly well. But, then again, Sizemore, Choo, Buck and Kearns really don't hit them at all. What could be the harm?


It depends on what you think Huffman has left. If you think "he is what he is", then I guess there's no harm in promoting him and adding him to the 40. He'd end up being DFA'd at the end of the year, though. Almost certainly. I guess the big question for him is simply what does he do for the team that Shelley Duncan wouldn't?

I agree on Valbuena, but it's hard to make a spot for him yet. They just promoted Phelps, and they're probably going to hang onto OCab. You could have him replace Everett, but Everett's role is almost a zero AB role at this point. It would be hard to find ABs for all 3 guys, even if you have one of them platoon at 3B with Hannahan.
User avatar
Edible14
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1045
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:49 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby ChadS17 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 6:57 pm

Wouldn't be opposed to it, but Huffman and Valbuena won't come up and suddenly make this a good offense.
ChadS17
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby indianinkslinger » Wed Jun 15, 2011 7:08 pm

Bearcatbob wrote:Where does Donald fit into your thinking?

If Donald is healthy, then he can fit in more than one place. IMO he is the best infield defender at the upper levels other Hannahan and AsCab. He has ML experience and I believe he will find it easier the second time around. He is going to need some time to get ready as I understand the move is not yet complete. I know I feel more comfortable with a 3B that hits RH even though Donald is not a "big power bat". The fact that he can give AsCab an occasional break at SS is a big plus. Long term I think he fits like Phelps as a utility IF. :pleasantry:
indianinkslinger
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2493
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 12:11 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby indianinkslinger » Wed Jun 15, 2011 7:10 pm

ChadS17 wrote:Wouldn't be opposed to it, but Huffman and Valbuena won't come up and suddenly make this a good offense.

Not good but maybe a bit better. :pleasantry:
indianinkslinger
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2493
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 12:11 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 7:20 pm

With Hafner due back soon, Huffman wouldn't see the field. Valbuena could see some time at 2B/3B but Phelps sits, so most likely he'd be just a bench guy too. Definitely wouldn't be opposed to seeing Valby back again though. He's earned it IMO
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby TonyIBI » Wed Jun 15, 2011 11:29 pm

Whenever Donald is healthy, he is probably the guy who supplants Hannahan. Remember, he was the guy who was gonna be the 3B to open the season until he got hurt.
User avatar
TonyIBI
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:03 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Wed Jun 15, 2011 11:35 pm

TonyIPI wrote:Whenever Donald is healthy, he is probably the guy who supplants Hannahan. Remember, he was the guy who was gonna be the 3B to open the season until he got hurt.


Possible...but he'll have to show a lot at 3B as Hannahan's defense alone is reason enough to keep starting him. Now Everett....
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby TonyIBI » Wed Jun 15, 2011 11:37 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
TonyIPI wrote:Whenever Donald is healthy, he is probably the guy who supplants Hannahan. Remember, he was the guy who was gonna be the 3B to open the season until he got hurt.


Possible...but he'll have to show a lot at 3B as Hannahan's defense alone is reason enough to keep starting him. Now Everett....


Donald replaces Everett on roster, and Donald and Hannahan share 3B and utility duties.
User avatar
TonyIBI
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:03 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby entertheshoe » Wed Jun 15, 2011 11:49 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
TonyIPI wrote:Whenever Donald is healthy, he is probably the guy who supplants Hannahan. Remember, he was the guy who was gonna be the 3B to open the season until he got hurt.


Possible...but he'll have to show a lot at 3B as Hannahan's defense alone is reason enough to keep starting him. Now Everett....


I'd like to see Donald take Everett's spot. That way he can possibly get a little platoon going simultaneously with Hannahan at 3rd and Orlando Cabrera at 2nd. Everett really serves no purpose aside from being a veteran.

Also, the way Marson is playing (and catching) it makes me wonder if LaPorta could play Left Field occasionally, primarily versus lefties to alternate giving a break to Sizemore, Hafner, Choo, and Brantley. That way Santana, LaPorta, and Marson can all be in at the same time. Just a thought.
entertheshoe
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:02 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:06 pm

I know the Everett/Donald/Valbuena/Phelps/Chiz/Kipnis controversy is intriguing, but for this year at least I don't think it matters much who's up and who's down. Although if Valbuena keeps raking like this I don't know how they keep him down, especially given the level of offense we've seen from Everett and Phelps and Kearns (Valbs also plays left field).

I'm looking at the starting rotation for next season. At this point we have three pitchers who have excelled or are excelling at Columbus in 2011:

White, 1-0, 1.90 ERA (4 starts)
McAllister, 7-2, 3.13 (11 starts)
Gomez, 6-1, 2.78 (9 starts)

Not to mention Scott Barnes, who is really coming on strong with 8 ER's allowed and a 2.25 ERA in his last six starts.

Compare those numbers to these Clipper starters from 2010:

Tomlin, 8-4, 2.68 ERA (17 starts)
Carrasco, 10-6, 3.65 (25 starts)

I'd say this year's crop compares very favorably to last year's graduates, both of whom are now starting for the Tribe. If McAllister, Gomez, and Barnes continue to pitch at this level of effectiveness and White makes a full recovery, all four of them should be candidates to crack the rotation next year. In that case, I'm not sure the Indians will want to exercise Fausto's $7 million club option should be continue to have the highest ERA of any starting pitcher in the AL.

Tomlin could be moved to long relief and be an instant upgrade over Durbin. Carrasco and Masterson's jobs should be safe, but I don't know if Talbot will be able to stave off the next wave of arms.

If these guys can keep it up in Columbus there could be some serious competition for starting jobs next spring. I think I'd pencil in Masterson, Carrasco, and White (if healthy) right now, but it could be a free-for-all between five or six guys for those last two spots. And that doesn't even include Pomeranz, who should be ready for the bigs at some point next season. Nice problem for Manny to have.

But what are we going to do for right-handed bats?
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Chip Davis » Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:02 am

Hopefully Rondon can recapture his form and has no setbacks. That would really add more quality depth to an already deep staff. Tony if you read this can you give us an update on Rondon please? Things can change for the worse quickly in this game, but even Huff seems to be coming around and I read somewhere that his velocity is back up to 94. He's buried though and I wonder what will become of him.

If the quality depth in pitching, catching, and middle infielders continue then they have the resources to get a right handed bat or 2. One could think that was logical anyway, but someone has to want what you have, and they have to have what you want. In other words, easier said than done. Maybe Goedert, Huffman, or McBride burst onto the scene unexpectedly.
Chip Davis
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 163
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:44 pm

Re: 2011 Clippers' Donald

Postby hoof32 » Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:49 am

Who can say if Jason Donald is in MLB-ready playing shape... couldn't he use some live pitching, AA-AAA level competition?

I don't like him being asked to re-prove himself, but Adam Everett seems to have done all that's been asked of him: plays all three positions more than competently, and has been no slouch at the plate, considering his low PA's.

With the two injuries Jason Donald's had to deal with, bringing him up 'just 'cause' and cutting Everett loose seems like a sideways move at best.
hoof32
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 114
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2010 1:35 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby GeronimoSon » Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:21 am

Prosecutor wrote:I know the Everett/Donald/Valbuena/Phelps/Chiz/Kipnis controversy is intriguing, but for this year at least I don't think it matters much who's up and who's down. Although if Valbuena keeps raking like this I don't know how they keep him down, especially given the level of offense we've seen from Everett and Phelps and Kearns (Valbs also plays left field).

I'm looking at the starting rotation for next season. At this point we have three pitchers who have excelled or are excelling at Columbus in 2011:

White, 1-0, 1.90 ERA (4 starts)
McAllister, 7-2, 3.13 (11 starts)
Gomez, 6-1, 2.78 (9 starts)

Not to mention Scott Barnes, who is really coming on strong with 8 ER's allowed and a 2.25 ERA in his last six starts.

Compare those numbers to these Clipper starters from 2010:

Tomlin, 8-4, 2.68 ERA (17 starts)
Carrasco, 10-6, 3.65 (25 starts)

I'd say this year's crop compares very favorably to last year's graduates, both of whom are now starting for the Tribe. If McAllister, Gomez, and Barnes continue to pitch at this level of effectiveness and White makes a full recovery, all four of them should be candidates to crack the rotation next year. In that case, I'm not sure the Indians will want to exercise Fausto's $7 million club option should be continue to have the highest ERA of any starting pitcher in the AL.

Tomlin could be moved to long relief and be an instant upgrade over Durbin. Carrasco and Masterson's jobs should be safe, but I don't know if Talbot will be able to stave off the next wave of arms.

If these guys can keep it up in Columbus there could be some serious competition for starting jobs next spring. I think I'd pencil in Masterson, Carrasco, and White (if healthy) right now, but it could be a free-for-all between five or six guys for those last two spots. And that doesn't even include Pomeranz, who should be ready for the bigs at some point next season. Nice problem for Manny to have.

But what are we going to do for right-handed bats?
No doubt about it.. the depth of arms in the minor league system is exactly where the Indians want it to be. With the potential addition of Dillon Howard to the mix, the recovery from surgery by Anthony Reyes and Hector Rondon, the emergence of Alex White, Drew Pomeranz, Scotty Barnes, Z-Mac, & JeanMar Gomez etc, etc. there is depth piled on top of depth. Depth is only there provided health and or the return to health continues. The recent revelation that Jason Knapp's required a second step repair to his shoulder is a warning that ".. just when you think you have enough pitching..it's time to go get more...". Even with that said..

The Indians surplus in one area can be "used" to fill a void in another area. The Indians may look at targeting some of the following couple of players currently in the minors for trade to fill the need for a RH bat:

-Cody Ranson: Is putting up good PCL numbers for both power and average for the DBax Reno squad. he's had four cups of coffee in the majors and hasn't stuck. He could be a career AAAA player or a change of scenary would do him good. The Dbax might be convinced that little Luis Valbuena has found it and would be a good 2B/SS/3B/LF super utility guy or would take over for Johnson at 2B. Stranger things have happened in the past...

-Brett Lawrie: Is the super stud future everything for the Toronto Blue Jays. He'd be very very expensive to acquire. He's exactly what the Indians need. The Jays need him just as much if not more. What the Jays don't have is the starting pitching depth and pen in their system.. While it's not a great fit from a trade perspective or a public relations perspective, the Jays and Indians could help each other by making a trade. Pomeranz could be the "piece" that makes this "one for one" happen.. IDK if I'd be willing to do this..

Other Names that might be considered:

-Japhet Amador: is a 24 year old right handed 1B who is hanging incredible numbers in the Mexican League. He gives both power: 20 HR's, Batting Average: .405 and Production: 69 RBI's What's not to like about this former Rookie of the Year in the Mexican League?

-Wily Mo Pena: Was mentioned on a thread in here before..He's worn out his welcome with several clubs, yet, has an incredible line of .360 21 HR's & 62 AB's in at AAA in the PCL. He can play poorly in LF, but can hit the hell out of a fastball.. It would be a miracle if the Indians consider him as he is not well thought of on many fronts..but wouldn't require much in the way of a spec to acquire.

Just a few random thoughts on acquisition of a RH bat... :wink:
GeronimoSon
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 3904
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 6:17 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Tondo » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:59 am

Since bats always need time and are harder to project, we will only trade for a proven MLB bat imho....especially if we trade for a PO shot

I see 2 good trade possibilities: 1B/OF Morse or 3B Reynolds..both hit LHP, both represent power upgrades and both have reasonable contracts. Reynolds would be perfect to ease in Chis as he'd be under contract for this and next season (7.5mil in 2012, 500k buyout on 11mil 2013), Morse is super cheap and is a FA...WAS does not have much leverage but he should still create a big market for a nie return, so he won't come cheap for a 3 month rental
Tondo
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 524
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:17 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:08 am

What is the level of pitching in the Mexican league? Is it equivalent to AA? A? I never heard of Amador but he's 24 so that's kind of old for a prospect.

I agree with your basic premise that the Tribe has "depth piled upon depth" in pitching prospects. I agree that a trade of pitching prospects for a right-handed bat makes sense.

However, I think it's very iffy as to whether Carmona's option gets picked up considering his performance this year and inconsistency the previous three years. I'm not sold on Talbot and the jury is still out on Tomlin, who might be better suited for long relief or as a less expensive replacement for Joe Smith. That means potentially three starting jobs could be up for grabs next spring, with White, McAllister, Huff, Gomez, Barnes and even Pomeranz in the mix. Rondon and Reyes probably need a year coming off major arm surgery to get fully up to speed. I'd be very careful about giving up too much starting pitching, but there is a crying need for a right-handed bat and you have to give up something to get something. Some risks may have to be taken.

I stopped counting but at one point I think the Tribe scored one earned run in 47 innings off left-handed pitching. They have no chance of winning a division if any left-hander can shut them down at any time.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby artgold » Fri Jun 17, 2011 11:41 am

If you're going to consider a trade to get hitting from the Arizona Diamondbacks, you have to look at where they have some quality guys and who is being blocked. Also, you want to keep in mind that they are also pretty "cost sensitive" so you may want to consider that aspect in any deal.

I see that Nady makes $1.75 million this year, and he provides a major league right handed bat. I don't think Arizona wants to retain him, based on the desire to give Miranda a full shot at 1st base this year. I don't think Nady adds much to the Indians, but he is right handed and competent. However, the guy I really want from the D'Backs is a minor league outfielder named Collin Cowgill, a righthanded batter who reminds me a bit of the Giants Cody Ross. He has a decent arm, and can play all OF positions adequately.

I'd look at dealing one of the pitchers for both Cowgill and Nady, possibly dumping a contract too. I'd probably see if I could do something on the order of Talbot and Kearns to Arizona for Nady and Cowgill. If they want a prospect type of player, I might consider throwing in a guy like Klubler or Adams too.

Works for me!
artgold
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1101
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 1:00 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Jun 17, 2011 12:18 pm

Prosecutor wrote:I stopped counting but at one point I think the Tribe scored one earned run in 47 innings off left-handed pitching. They have no chance of winning a division if any left-hander can shut them down at any time.


Tribe's batting line as a team against LHP this year: .252/.314/.372/.686

Against RHP: .250/.321/.403/.724


Problem isn't just the lefties....problem is we can't hit ANYONE.

Last 7 games the team line is: .202/.275/.279/.554.....and we faced 7 right handed starters.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby entertheshoe » Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:06 pm

(I'd just like to point out how far off track this thread has gotten from the Clippers. I can't help but chime in though)

As much as everyone wants to acquire a right handed bat, there are really just two spots where they could go to get everyday play - 2nd base and 3rd base. And as everyone knows, anybody acquired at those positions will be a one year rental most likely as Chiz/Kipnis will likely be playing there everyday come 2012. That is of course unless the Tribe wants to trade Grady, Choo, or even Chiz in order to get a righty bat.

I can't help but look at the Cubs as a possible trading partner if the team wants a quick fix at some of our need positions.

3B Aramis Ramirez - has a full no trade clause but is a power righty bat at 3rd base whose contract can end at the end of the season. He has a pretty fat contract but maybe the Cubs could pay some of it. Interestingly, the Cubs also have a right handed 3rd base contract Josh Vitters in AA right now so I wonder if he and Chiz could somehow be involved in a swap.

RH Outfielder - Marlon Byrd and Alfonso Soriano are quality RH bats. Byrd is much much more affordable and Soriano has possibly the worst contract in baseball. It's hard to think that he would play out his 18 million/year contract that ends in 2014 for the struggling Cubs. Would be interesting to look into either of these guys, primarily Byrd nonetheless. Heck, even Reed Johnson (34) is swinging a surprisingly hot bat.

Starting Pitching - Take your pick out of Carlos Zambrano, Matt Garza, and Ryan Dempster. While the performance so far this year may not match their contracts, that may make them cheaper to buy. Garza and Zambrano could easily take Talbot's spot in the rotation. Sure Zambrano is a hot head but when his game is on he's a potentially great asset down the stretch.

Bullpen arm - Kerry Wood! He has a no trade clause I believe but I don't think he really hated Cleveland all that much. He could become the setup man for Perez and give us another bullpen arm to our already strong pen.

Quickly glancing at the Cubs prospects, I don't know if there's all that much for them to be excited about. Especially after they traded Hak-Ju Lee (WHAT were they thinking?). I don't see any catching prospects and their major league catcher Geovany Soto is batting .220. This could make Lou Marson or Chun Chen as hot commodities to the Cubs.

Most likely none of this will happen, it's still fun to think about though.
entertheshoe
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:02 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Bearcatbob » Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:26 pm

Unless we are able to get a stud RH bat - like what LaPorta was supposed to be - I think we simply stick in house. As I have said, if we get five games back - we can play Kipnis and Chiz.

To me it is clear that adjusting to the majors takes time. A guy hitting .300 at Cbus is hitting against pitchers who are not yet 5s in a major league rotation. When the team we have faces a 5 - this team hits too.

Bob
Bearcatbob
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 597
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:10 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby ChadS17 » Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:12 pm

Bearcatbob wrote:Unless we are able to get a stud RH bat - like what LaPorta was supposed to be - I think we simply stick in house. As I have said, if we get five games back - we can play Kipnis and Chiz.

To me it is clear that adjusting to the majors takes time. A guy hitting .300 at Cbus is hitting against pitchers who are not yet 5s in a major league rotation. When the team we have faces a 5 - this team hits too.

Bob


I don't understand your "when we get 5 games out" theory. You could be 5 out in the middle of August and still should be trying to make a run at it. I understand your pessimism, but our hot start will likely keep us in it for a while. JMO
ChadS17
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:02 pm

Just to add to what I was saying earlier about Columbus pitchers in line to start for the Tribe next year, I came up with these splits:

Mitch Talbot

vs. right-handed hitters: .228/.303 OBP
vs. lefties: .419/.488

I can't believe any pitcher that allows left-handed hitters to bat .419 and get on base at a .488 clip is starting material in the bigs. If those numbers on the bottom line don't improve dramatically over the next couple of months, or sooner, it's time to get McAllister or Barnes or Gomez up here. Most teams can easily put six or seven left-handed hitters in the lineup on any given night.

Josh Tomlin

Pitches 1-15: .141 BAA/.419 OPS
Pitches 16-30: .247/.826
Pitches 31-45: .323/.835
Pitches 46-60: .267/.741

Those numbers scream relief pitcher to me. Tomlin has another interesting set of splits:

Hitters 1-5: .197 BAA
Hitters 6-9: .316 BAA, all at least .300 against him

For some odd reason Tomlin is really good against the better hitters but sucks once he gets to the bottom of the lineup. Maybe he psychologically gears up for the big bats and lets down against the weaker hitters. Maybe those numbers converge as the season goes on.

If Talbot sticks around next year he shouldn't be facing any lefties at all. That means he could be competing with Joe Smith for a job in the pen, or maybe he'll replace Herrmann. Tomlin should take Durbin's job. And Carmona should not be given $7 million unless he improves that 5.97 ERA considerably.

Which means Masterson and Carrasco are the only starters from this year that look like they'll be in the rotation next year unless Carmona does a huge about-face. So the door is open for White, Gomez, McAllister, Barnes, Huff and even Pomeranz to duke it out the rest of this year and in spring training.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:46 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
Prosecutor wrote:I stopped counting but at one point I think the Tribe scored one earned run in 47 innings off left-handed pitching. They have no chance of winning a division if any left-hander can shut them down at any time.


Tribe's batting line as a team against LHP this year: .252/.314/.372/.686

Against RHP: .250/.321/.403/.724


Problem isn't just the lefties....problem is we can't hit ANYONE.

Last 7 games the team line is: .202/.275/.279/.554.....and we faced 7 right handed starters.


I went back and did it again for the last 23 games starting with the Boston series. It comes out to 4 earned runs in the last 56.1 innings against left-handed pitching. Over the last 23 games lefties have a 0.64 ERA against the Tribe.

In April guys like Hannahan and Marson and Duncan were hitting lefties. So if you look at the numbers for the entire season they don't look too bad, as you pointed out. But Duncan is gone and Marson and Hannahan are no longer hitting .300 against lefties, so you have to look at what's happening now, and it ain't pretty.

Maybe it's a combination of Hafner being out (although hitting lefties is not his specialty) and facing some pretty good lefties in guys like Lester, Price, and Wilson (good thing we missed Sabathia). So by the end of the year I expect the numbers will be better than the last month but not as good as they were in April, which was an anomaly.

We'll keep an eye on how the Tribe does against lefties from here on out, but if we don't see significant improvement they will almost be forced to explore trading a top prospect or two for a right-handed bat, especially considering the ridiculous pitching depth they have in the minors.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby entertheshoe » Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:49 pm

Prosecutor wrote:Just to add to what I was saying earlier about Columbus pitchers in line to start for the Tribe next year, I came up with these splits:

Mitch Talbot

vs. right-handed hitters: .228/.303 OBP
vs. lefties: .419/.488

I can't believe any pitcher that allows left-handed hitters to bat .419 and get on base at a .488 clip is starting material in the bigs. If those numbers on the bottom line don't improve dramatically over the next couple of months, or sooner, it's time to get McAllister or Barnes or Gomez up here. Most teams can easily put six or seven left-handed hitters in the lineup on any given night.

Josh Tomlin

Pitches 1-15: .141 BAA/.419 OPS
Pitches 16-30: .247/.826
Pitches 31-45: .323/.835
Pitches 46-60: .267/.741

Those numbers scream relief pitcher to me. Tomlin has another interesting set of splits:

Hitters 1-5: .197 BAA
Hitters 6-9: .316 BAA, all at least .300 against him

For some odd reason Tomlin is really good against the better hitters but sucks once he gets to the bottom of the lineup. Maybe he psychologically gears up for the big bats and lets down against the weaker hitters. Maybe those numbers converge as the season goes on.

If Talbot sticks around next year he shouldn't be facing any lefties at all. That means he could be competing with Joe Smith for a job in the pen, or maybe he'll replace Herrmann. Tomlin should take Durbin's job. And Carmona should not be given $7 million unless he improves that 5.97 ERA considerably.

Which means Masterson and Carrasco are the only starters from this year that look like they'll be in the rotation next year unless Carmona does a huge about-face. So the door is open for White, Gomez, McAllister, Barnes, Huff and even Pomeranz to duke it out the rest of this year and in spring training.


I strongly disagree with your reasoning to send Tomlin to the pen. You want your best pitchers pitching the most innings and sending Tomlin to the bullpen just because he wears out as the game goes on doesn't make sense to me. Most pitchers will do that. The #1 starter should be your best pitcher. The #2 should be your 2nd best. Follow this trend until you reach your 5th starter and then your 6th best starter should be relegated to long relief duty or AAA starter. It makes no sense to have our most consistent pitcher for the season get demoted to long relief where he will be utilized not only less often but also in situations where the starting pitcher performed poorly and has gone less than 5 innings (usually) most likely with the game out of hand anyways. You want your best pitchers pitching the most innings and Tomlin has pitched 82 innings whereas if he were in long relief he'd be utilized as much as Durbin or Herrmann, who combined have pitched 48.

I almost think one has a better argument for putting Masterson in the bullpen as a right handed specialist because of his awful numbers versus lefties and his lights out pitching versus righties. Still, Talbot is the only pitcher who really deserves any talk of a demotion at the moment. Tomlin's job is safe in my book and it should be in most others.
entertheshoe
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:02 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Fri Jun 17, 2011 4:58 pm

Prosecutor wrote: you have to look at what's happening now, and it ain't pretty.



We'll keep an eye on how the Tribe does against lefties from here on out, but if we don't see significant improvement they will almost be forced to explore trading a top prospect or two for a right-handed bat, especially considering the ridiculous pitching depth they have in the minors.


Agree....but it's been fugly against righties too. Look at the last 7 games in over 56 innings against righties...and what's the offense done? Better than that number you gave, but still pathetic.


If things don't change, Tribe has way, way, way bigger issues than getting a right-handed bat. I'd take 9 lefties that could hit righties right now.....

Point wasn't against how bad we've been against lefties. It's just that we haven't been good against righties either. Team could definitely use a big right-handed bat. Think everyone agrees there. Disagree strongly that we 'need' to trade away some top prospects to get one though.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:49 pm

entertheshoe wrote:I strongly disagree with your reasoning to send Tomlin to the pen. You want your best pitchers pitching the most innings and sending Tomlin to the bullpen just because he wears out as the game goes on doesn't make sense to me. Most pitchers will do that. The #1 starter should be your best pitcher. The #2 should be your 2nd best. Follow this trend until you reach your 5th starter and then your 6th best starter should be relegated to long relief duty or AAA starter. It makes no sense to have our most consistent pitcher for the season get demoted to long relief where he will be utilized not only less often but also in situations where the starting pitcher performed poorly and has gone less than 5 innings (usually) most likely with the game out of hand anyways. You want your best pitchers pitching the most innings and Tomlin has pitched 82 innings whereas if he were in long relief he'd be utilized as much as Durbin or Herrmann, who combined have pitched 48.


I'm talking about next season. Tomlin was great his first time around the league but it looks like teams might be figuring him out based on his last three starts. If that's the case then I don't think he will be one of the five "best" starters on the team next year. If that's the case then he'd be perfect for the long reliever role because he has shown he can be very effective for 5 innings or so.

As higher upside prospects like White, Pomz, and McAllister force their way into the rotation along with Masterson, Carrasco, and possibly Carmona, I'm thinking Tomlin may be the odd man out. OTOH, if he can get back to pitching the way he was before his last three starts then he should be able to hang onto his starting job next year. His performance the rest of the season will be critical to his role next year.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby entertheshoe » Fri Jun 17, 2011 11:19 pm

Prosecutor wrote:
entertheshoe wrote:I strongly disagree with your reasoning to send Tomlin to the pen. You want your best pitchers pitching the most innings and sending Tomlin to the bullpen just because he wears out as the game goes on doesn't make sense to me. Most pitchers will do that. The #1 starter should be your best pitcher. The #2 should be your 2nd best. Follow this trend until you reach your 5th starter and then your 6th best starter should be relegated to long relief duty or AAA starter. It makes no sense to have our most consistent pitcher for the season get demoted to long relief where he will be utilized not only less often but also in situations where the starting pitcher performed poorly and has gone less than 5 innings (usually) most likely with the game out of hand anyways. You want your best pitchers pitching the most innings and Tomlin has pitched 82 innings whereas if he were in long relief he'd be utilized as much as Durbin or Herrmann, who combined have pitched 48.


I'm talking about next season. Tomlin was great his first time around the league but it looks like teams might be figuring him out based on his last three starts. If that's the case then I don't think he will be one of the five "best" starters on the team next year. If that's the case then he'd be perfect for the long reliever role because he has shown he can be very effective for 5 innings or so.

As higher upside prospects like White, Pomz, and McAllister force their way into the rotation along with Masterson, Carrasco, and possibly Carmona, I'm thinking Tomlin may be the odd man out. OTOH, if he can get back to pitching the way he was before his last three starts then he should be able to hang onto his starting job next year. His performance the rest of the season will be critical to his role next year.


3 bad starts after ~20 consecutive quality starts and you're making plans to move the guy to the bullpen? I guess that's where we'll have to agree to disagree. As far as higher upside prospects go, White and Pomeranz I'll give you but I don't consider McAllister as higher upside than Tomlin. I think I have Scott Barnes and Gomez above McAllister anyhow but either way each of them are still prospects. We already see what we have in Tomlin on the other hand. To me, for Tomlin to get downgraded to long relief he's going to have to lose his job, it's as simple as that. There's no way that I'm going to give his spot to an unproven prospect when I virtually know that I can get a solid 6 innings out of him every time he's on the rubber. If it's not broken, I'm not fixing it. The way he finishes the year is important, but it's no more important to me than it is for every other starter on the rotation.
entertheshoe
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:02 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby TonyIBI » Sat Jun 18, 2011 1:07 am

Whoever asked about Rondon, I wouldn't expect him to pitch anywhere except maybe AZL late in the year. He and Alexander Perez will get most of work in AZL and Instructs/Fall leagues.

As for Tomlin to the bullpen, no way. Guy is just a solid pitcher. Not sexy, but guy competes and wins. Perfect 3/4 starter if you ask me.
User avatar
TonyIBI
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:03 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Sat Jun 18, 2011 8:01 am

Hopefully Tomlin's last four starts before the Pirates game where he gave up 22 runs in 23 innings was just a pitcher's slump and he'll get back to normal soon. Last night's game against the Pie Rats was encouraging even if they're a weak offensive team.

I'm just leery of guys that don't throw hard and rely on guile and location to be successful. I remember when Jeremy Sowers came up in mid-season he had one of the top five ERA's in the league for the second half, and I had him penciled in as a 10-year starter. He was a first round pick and had moved quickly through the minors with success at every level. I bought into him completely. Once the major league hitters figured him out, though, it was all over. So I'm wondering if we're seeing the same dynamic at work with Tomlin.

If he gets back to pitching like he did in April and early May I'm fine with him staying in the rotation. If he ends up being a 4.50 guy, long relief would be his ideal role.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Bearcatbob » Sat Jun 18, 2011 8:50 am

Hey gang - I see Cbus has won 10 in a row!
Bearcatbob
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 597
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:10 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Chip Davis » Sat Jun 18, 2011 2:10 pm

TonyIPI wrote:Whoever asked about Rondon, I wouldn't expect him to pitch anywhere except maybe AZL late in the year. He and Alexander Perez will get most of work in AZL and Instructs/Fall leagues.

As for Tomlin to the bullpen, no way. Guy is just a solid pitcher. Not sexy, but guy competes and wins. Perfect 3/4 starter if you ask me.


That was me. Thanks for the response and I forgot about A. Perez alltogether. Hopefully they both comeback strong as ever.
Chip Davis
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 163
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:44 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Sat Jun 18, 2011 2:53 pm

Prosecutor wrote:If he gets back to pitching like he did in April and early May I'm fine with him staying in the rotation. If he ends up being a 4.50 guy, long relief would be his ideal role.


Depends what we have, but even playoff teams would normally take a 4.50 ERA guy as their #5 starter at worst. that's a "quality start" (6 innings, 3 runs).
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Prosecutor » Sat Jun 18, 2011 7:17 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
Prosecutor wrote:If he gets back to pitching like he did in April and early May I'm fine with him staying in the rotation. If he ends up being a 4.50 guy, long relief would be his ideal role.


Depends what we have, but even playoff teams would normally take a 4.50 ERA guy as their #5 starter at worst. that's a "quality start" (6 innings, 3 runs).


True, but my hope is that a 4.50 ERA isn't good enough to start for the Tribe in '12.
Prosecutor
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Edible14 » Sat Jun 18, 2011 11:27 pm

Prosecutor wrote:Hopefully Tomlin's last four starts before the Pirates game where he gave up 22 runs in 23 innings was just a pitcher's slump and he'll get back to normal soon. Last night's game against the Pie Rats was encouraging even if they're a weak offensive team.


The thing that makes me somewhat weary of Tomlin is that other teams seem to eventually catch on to what he's doing. By the third time around in the order, teams start to really hit him, and I think Acta knows this (there's been a few times this season where he's pulled in the 7th inning or so even if he has a low pitch count. He was only at 85 against Pittsburgh). I fear that the league will eventually figure him out, but I had this same fear last year. Still, that's the thing that makes me weary of him, not his lack of K's.
User avatar
Edible14
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1045
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:49 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Edible14 » Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:00 pm

As awesome as Head was hitting for the first two months, he's been hitting .222 since May 30th (.333 SLG, .288 OBA for a .621 OPS). While it would be unfair to just dismiss his first two months, I think it's clear that he's no longer anywhere near the front of the line for a call-up, if he ever was.
User avatar
Edible14
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1045
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:49 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby indianinkslinger » Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:50 am

I watched last night's game on MiLB to see the status of a couple of potential promotions. First and foremost is Nick Johnson. He looked somewhat better on close observation but I would be hard pressed to believe that his plate recognition skills and power issues will be resolved with any degree of acceptable ML performance in less than 30 days. Johnson looks like he is just feeling his way around baseball and is not ready to push his considerable skills any further at this time.

Although Jason Donald is of more interest to me, i seriously doubt many on the site feel the same. I was greatly heartened by both offense and defense. He will help the Indians IMO and his callup probably is not too far away. I would guess somewhere around the all star break. As nice as it is to see a rookie like Phelps get his chance, the growing pains of rookies maturing at the ML level should probably be avoided. Donald did his growing last year and knows what to expect.

Carrera was on my list and I was not disappointed. He looks like a far more productive "4th OF" than Buck with Carrera's defense and speed. At this time, I would rather see him batting leadoff in Cleveland rather than Sizemore. Even if Sizemore recovers some of what he has lost, IMO the Indians would be better served by someone who has leadoff skills now than someone who had them years ago.

Although I was not really watching Barnes, he looked much more in the zone than last game to me. He appears well on this way to becoming a ML pitcher. Right now, he looks to have more upside than McAlistair and is close to Gomez, who has better command of his fast ball than Barnes. Nice situation for Cleveland.
indianinkslinger
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2493
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 12:11 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:47 pm

Prosecutor wrote:
Hermie13 wrote:
Prosecutor wrote:If he gets back to pitching like he did in April and early May I'm fine with him staying in the rotation. If he ends up being a 4.50 guy, long relief would be his ideal role.


Depends what we have, but even playoff teams would normally take a 4.50 ERA guy as their #5 starter at worst. that's a "quality start" (6 innings, 3 runs).


True, but my hope is that a 4.50 ERA isn't good enough to start for the Tribe in '12.


While that would be amazing....how many rotations out there can you really say that about? Take even the Phillies, Blanton has been a 4.50 ERA guy (4.82 in 2010) and was in that rotation. Oakland is the one rotatoin I can think of that you can truely say a 4.5 ERA guy isn't good enough. It's just so hard to have 5 guys going into a season and say they'll all be better than a 4.50 ERA. Even if you throw over $50M at the rotation it's hard to do that.
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:59 pm

indianinkslinger wrote:I watched last night's game on MiLB to see the status of a couple of potential promotions. First and foremost is Nick Johnson. He looked somewhat better on close observation but I would be hard pressed to believe that his plate recognition skills and power issues will be resolved with any degree of acceptable ML performance in less than 30 days. Johnson looks like he is just feeling his way around baseball and is not ready to push his considerable skills any further at this time.

Although Jason Donald is of more interest to me, i seriously doubt many on the site feel the same. I was greatly heartened by both offense and defense. He will help the Indians IMO and his callup probably is not too far away. I would guess somewhere around the all star break. As nice as it is to see a rookie like Phelps get his chance, the growing pains of rookies maturing at the ML level should probably be avoided. Donald did his growing last year and knows what to expect.

Carrera was on my list and I was not disappointed. He looks like a far more productive "4th OF" than Buck with Carrera's defense and speed. At this time, I would rather see him batting leadoff in Cleveland rather than Sizemore. Even if Sizemore recovers some of what he has lost, IMO the Indians would be better served by someone who has leadoff skills now than someone who had them years ago.

Although I was not really watching Barnes, he looked much more in the zone than last game to me. He appears well on this way to becoming a ML pitcher. Right now, he looks to have more upside than McAlistair and is close to Gomez, who has better command of his fast ball than Barnes. Nice situation for Cleveland.



Like you observations for the most part. Only thing I'm not too sold on is Carrera being a better leadoff option. You make a good point about Phelps and breaking in rookies.....but you want to take a rookie and bat him leadoff?

We've seen numerous times over the last few years that guys with good plate discipline and the ability to draw walks seemingly lose this ability at the ML level. Brantley and Valbuena were touted as OBP guys who could draw walks....yet at the ML level (especially when breaking in) lost that as pitchers challenged them. Only guy I can recall who hasn't fallen in the funk is Santana (who is a compeltely different type of hitter).

I really think you're being overly optimistic on Carrera's ability to bat leadoff (or overly harsh on Sizmore). We've seen how long it's taken brantley and he is still not a leadoff hitter. I really question whether Carrera could maintain his walk rate at the ML level. Though maybe you see something vastly different and think he'll maintain it? Very possible I guess.


I do agree that Carrera could be as good a 4th OFer as Buck.....or Kearns who is really technically the 4th OFer :bad:
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Lloyd Christmas » Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:20 pm

Carmona is not even a career 4.50 ERA guy so I would hope that the Indians would be happy with that. They certainly shouldnt expect anything better
Lloyd Christmas
Draft Prospect
 
Posts: 248
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:18 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby A.Zajac » Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:26 pm

JRod traded to the Pirates for cash.
Follow me on Twitter!
@AndrewIPI
User avatar
A.Zajac
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 3133
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 10:31 am
Location: Struthers, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby homerawayfromhome » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:15 pm

@ AZajac not a surprise.
homerawayfromhome
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2411
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:17 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby entertheshoe » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:22 pm

Wait, what?

Wasn't JRod picked up by the Pirates in the rule V draft, then released by them?

Now they want him back for cash?

:wacko:
entertheshoe
Rookie Baller
 
Posts: 494
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:02 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby daingean » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:32 pm

entertheshoe wrote:Wait, what?

Wasn't JRod picked up by the Pirates in the rule V draft, then released by them?

Now they want him back for cash?

:wacko:


He had to be returned because they didn't want to carry him on the 25 man roster. They can now keep him at AAA which is where he should be to complete his development. He was just behind several other infielders with the Tribe. This way he has a chance to make it back to the show. I suspect the Pirates tried to work out a deal with the Tribe before they sent him back to us.
daingean
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1535
Joined: Fri May 15, 2009 12:06 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby indianinkslinger » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:04 pm

Hermie13 wrote:
indianinkslinger wrote:I watched last night's game on MiLB to see the status of a couple of potential promotions. First and foremost is Nick Johnson. He looked somewhat better on close observation but I would be hard pressed to believe that his plate recognition skills and power issues will be resolved with any degree of acceptable ML performance in less than 30 days. Johnson looks like he is just feeling his way around baseball and is not ready to push his considerable skills any further at this time.

Although Jason Donald is of more interest to me, i seriously doubt many on the site feel the same. I was greatly heartened by both offense and defense. He will help the Indians IMO and his callup probably is not too far away. I would guess somewhere around the all star break. As nice as it is to see a rookie like Phelps get his chance, the growing pains of rookies maturing at the ML level should probably be avoided. Donald did his growing last year and knows what to expect.

Carrera was on my list and I was not disappointed. He looks like a far more productive "4th OF" than Buck with Carrera's defense and speed. At this time, I would rather see him batting leadoff in Cleveland rather than Sizemore. Even if Sizemore recovers some of what he has lost, IMO the Indians would be better served by someone who has leadoff skills now than someone who had them years ago.

Although I was not really watching Barnes, he looked much more in the zone than last game to me. He appears well on this way to becoming a ML pitcher. Right now, he looks to have more upside than McAlistair and is close to Gomez, who has better command of his fast ball than Barnes. Nice situation for Cleveland.



Like you observations for the most part. Only thing I'm not too sold on is Carrera being a better leadoff option. You make a good point about Phelps and breaking in rookies.....but you want to take a rookie and bat him leadoff?

We've seen numerous times over the last few years that guys with good plate discipline and the ability to draw walks seemingly lose this ability at the ML level. Brantley and Valbuena were touted as OBP guys who could draw walks....yet at the ML level (especially when breaking in) lost that as pitchers challenged them. Only guy I can recall who hasn't fallen in the funk is Santana (who is a compeltely different type of hitter).

I really think you're being overly optimistic on Carrera's ability to bat leadoff (or overly harsh on Sizmore). We've seen how long it's taken brantley and he is still not a leadoff hitter. I really question whether Carrera could maintain his walk rate at the ML level. Though maybe you see something vastly different and think he'll maintain it? Very possible I guess.


I do agree that Carrera could be as good a 4th OFer as Buck.....or Kearns who is really technically the 4th OFer :bad:

I said nothing about wanting Carrera to bat leadoff for the Indians. I only said than i would rather Carrera bat leadoff than Sizemore, which is entirely different. Brantley is my first choice by far even with a small slump but nearly every player in Cleveland/Columbus who can steal a base and won't strike out half the time can probably do a better job leading off than Sizemore is doing now IMO. If he can hit LHP at 200, so much the better. :tease:
indianinkslinger
Triple-A Stud
 
Posts: 2493
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 12:11 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Pork Chop Pough » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:15 pm

Glad to see Rodriguez go to a place where he'll get a real opportunity... or at least not be stuck in limbo. He might have a career as a MLB utility player, but Cleveland already has a long line of those who probably have more upside. Pittsburgh should give him 2-3 weeks to play SS at AAA. If he can still handle it at all, he'd be a better all-around player than Ronny Cedeno. It's too bad they couldn't have just worked this deal out in the first place, instead of having him waste two months of his season.
User avatar
Pork Chop Pough
Single-A Phenom
 
Posts: 507
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Hermie13 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:03 pm

indianinkslinger wrote:I said nothing about wanting Carrera to bat leadoff for the Indians. I only said than i would rather Carrera bat leadoff than Sizemore, which is entirely different. Brantley is my first choice by far even with a small slump but nearly every player in Cleveland/Columbus who can steal a base and won't strike out half the time can probably do a better job leading off than Sizemore is doing now IMO. If he can hit LHP at 200, so much the better. :tease:


Fair enough, you are right did kind of combine your two posts there.

To each their own on who should hit leadoff I guess. I like the guy getting on base better, but it's basically a wash so o well.

While I don't like Grady's strikeout numbers.....don't really see what the issue is with a K vs some other kind of out when hitting leadoff (not like you're trying to move a runner over, hit n run, or get a sac fly with no one on base). And having your leadoff guy as your best basestealer, while a conventional way of thinking, has been shown to be meaningless over the course of the season (almost better to have that guy batting 6th or 7th).
Hermie13
MLB All Star
 
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:34 am
Location: Cleveland, OH

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby Edible14 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:24 am

Pork Chop Pough wrote:Glad to see Rodriguez go to a place where he'll get a real opportunity... or at least not be stuck in limbo. He might have a career as a MLB utility player, but Cleveland already has a long line of those who probably have more upside. Pittsburgh should give him 2-3 weeks to play SS at AAA. If he can still handle it at all, he'd be a better all-around player than Ronny Cedeno. It's too bad they couldn't have just worked this deal out in the first place, instead of having him waste two months of his season.


Yeah. I guess he was hurt for some of that time (?), but I really didn't understand why the Indians didn't at the very least stick him in Akron to get some ABs. If they really cared that little for JRod... why take him back when there's already quite the crowd in the IF at Columbus?
User avatar
Edible14
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1045
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:49 am

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:24 pm

Chiz back in the lineup tonight and singles in his first AB
dazindiansfanuk
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1854
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:51 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby TonyIBI » Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:32 pm

dazindiansfanuk wrote:Chiz back in the lineup tonight and singles in his first AB


Call him up! :crazy:
User avatar
TonyIBI
MLB Rookie
 
Posts: 5056
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:03 pm

Re: 2011 Columbus Clippers Thread

Postby dazindiansfanuk » Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:49 pm

Kluber managed to wriggle himself out of a potential disaster first inning.

Started BB, BB, BB, 1B, 1B to make it 2-0 with the bases loaded and none out.... fly out, pop out and a K though keep it at 2-0.... Kluber needed 43 pitches (20 strikes) to get through the frame.
dazindiansfanuk
Double-A Hot Shot
 
Posts: 1854
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:51 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Indians Prospect Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron